Part 2: Love, Viv

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Welcome back to the second part of

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Love. Viv,

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from the beginning, Viv, I can always tell that you were a true

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empath, right? You always cared so much about

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the people that were working for you,

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for your employee, for everyone around you.

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And I mean, you could really tell that you cared. You actually gave a

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shit 100% and. That.

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Everybody was welcome. You gave the best

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hugs, and you always made people laugh. And

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every interaction, you've made people feel good about being

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them. And just as a company, I mean,

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I think back on my 45 years of working,

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I'd never felt that before. And

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like I said before, I feel fortunate. You know what, I worked for a

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once in a lifetime company. It made me a better person.

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I have the best friendships from that company.

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It just made me a better human. But I think

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it ultimate did that for everyone that walked in that door, though.

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Legend I think the biggest thing compliment I ever got

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was people walking in the door. Orientation says, if you're not there from day

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one, I felt like everyone was here to help me.

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Everyone was here to help me succeed. And every company

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I worked for, everybody, no one wanted to help me because they were all in

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fear of their role, of their job. Like, I'm not going to give you all

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this information because you might replace me one day. Ultimate

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I remember the Ups guy coming in and FedEx people and says,

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everyone's so happy. Like, it's not

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rocket science. And it's so hard to convince

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organizations to actually get

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it, where if you really take care of your people who are taking care of

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you, and you make sure they're happy and you run by exception and

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not the rule of like and I told that to everybody. I told my entire

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team, we run by exception. So if someone needs something and that's not the

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policy that we did, we care, okay, to

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break that policy. But everybody's individual, everybody has their

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story. And if we go beyond and beyond, I remember so much and I remember

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Bob Manny telling me, viv, you're setting up a president. I don't give a fuck

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if I setting a president. This is an individual who has expired their

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twelve weeks of leave, who we've paid for, who still is either

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a dying or they're in a situation that is that's

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where the human side comes in, right? Like, let your

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humanity, let your heart take care of your people versus

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your financials. You do that. And I can tell

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you so many exceptions we did. But you know what?

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That itself is your brand. That word gets

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out and you don't have to say at the leadership, we don't

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have to say a work, let the people talk who have been

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affected so many times, so many individuals that they were

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the exception. I'm going to get crying.

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Sorry. Way to go, dirty skittles. Way to

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go. Look, I am innocent. I do it to myself. I do it

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to myself because I know all the stories. I know

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the heartbreak and I know the camaraderie. I

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remember after somebody lost

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someone or someone in a hardship, the biggest compliment I

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would always get was like right away a peep would

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send me an email or call me, says, viv, can we do something to help?

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And you know what I said? You all are empowered. It can't be

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just ultimate at top. You are all empowered and should feel response that

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we all got to come together to help each other through good times, through bad

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times, but we all got to come together and help each other till this

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day. That still happens.

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It really does. And

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it's so interesting to hear you speak about this now, because

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if somebody was to sit me down and say, can you tell us exactly how

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they did it? How they made this family? Because we all are.

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That's the only way I can describe it is that ultimate was a family of

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somehow the same people that were uniquely different, right?

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And I don't know how you guys did it, other than

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you had action, right? Like your action mirrored your

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words and it was felt. And

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still to this day, we will recognize

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each other. We're like, you're an ulti peep. Without even maybe having worked with

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them before, that feeling is still there. Like we all still kind of hold on

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to it. But you know what? The biggest things I've

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gone probably in the last year, I've gone to three funerals of

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peeps who have passed. And it just touches my heart

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every time I see peeps from everywhere where there's more peeps

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than family. I mean, there's a lot of family there, but that majority of that

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room is peeps. Peeps who have gone, peeps who have retired.

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Everybody just comes together. And that bond, it's just so hard

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because I get asked millions of times like, oh, how do you do it? I'm

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like, you know what? It's not like

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I sought out to intentionally create this, right? It wasn't

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intentional. Like the more benefits because we'll get on the rating. We

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didn't apply for a rating until twelve years later after Alti was done,

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that we then applied to Best Places to Work because Linda Miller, VP of

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Marketing, thought it would be good for the business. But even when we applied for

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the Best Places to Work, that Sherm thing, by

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the way, we were small. We had been in business twelve years, but we just

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let the employees I actually remember it was a book and it was

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in their voices. It was employees just telling stories. And that's what

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we submitted, obviously. And we had data and stuff to put in,

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and we ranked number twelve the first time we ever submitted.

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I said, oh my God, this was easy. I didn't do anything it was just

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because the same thing. That was something that we did from

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the first day. That's just buscott. And I believe, thank God our

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values matched. And we just treated people like humans,

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right? And we always made them, no matter when we didn't have any. It was

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never about financials. It was never about not having enough money. It

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was always about what's the right thing to do? Who needs our help? Who

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needs an exception? And again, look, I terminated a lot of people,

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but I terminated a lot of people who gave me hugs and cried knowing that

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they know they just couldn't do that role. But we did it the right

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way, right? I put them on a progressive. We talked to them. I had them

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in my office. It's like, look this way. You guys just need to perform. But

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sometimes we hired wrong. We hired people that couldn't do their jobs, that it

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wasn't their fault. We put them in a role. They could not succeed,

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but we also give them an opportunity to find something else. Or do

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you have skill sets that maybe could be good in another position? Who I've had

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that a lot. Who thrived in another role because we put them in a different

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position. But again, it all goes back to that human

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value of caring for people. And even

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I used to have conversations, look, you're not Pip. I was like, I'm just telling

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you, it's not going to work out. You can't do it. And

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they understood and it was fine. But I still gave them severance. I still

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kept the healthcare to the end. There's that human factor that

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these are people, right? The same thing when I heard

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NADP cuts your health care the day you leave and you don't get any

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severance, I'm like, that's insane, because I have appointments for my kids

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scheduled in two weeks. I don't have health care now, and I don't have a

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paycheck. Like, where's the humanity in businesses?

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And that's what I thought, that I didn't want Alti to be like that, so

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I made Ulti to be like nothing else. We're just

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more on the humankind. And there's so much

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research when you do that, and that's where your loyalty,

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dedication, everyone has how do you get them all so loyal? There

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were people that I walked around on New Year's Eve, on Christmas Eve,

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Thanksgiving, and support was on calls. You know, this very

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mean they wouldn't hang up, not because they had to, but

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because they wanted to. They wanted to help that customer because they were

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working for Ulti. And Alti was in their hearts. And I said, go

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home. Like, no, I will after this last that is

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priceless. And it was because they wanted to. People check on emails.

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I would send emails on weekends because that was my time that I had

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to think. But I never expected responses. And I

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have all these people responding like, what are you doing? Responding like viv. Why wouldn't

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I? But because they wanted to. No one would ever say, well, I

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sent you an email Monday on Friday at three. I didn't get an email to

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Monday because that's what ultimate

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did to people. It gave them a

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purpose, and they felt truly a community and a

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family. That everything we and I made it very clear, and you girls

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know, at New Hire, it was like, we all got to work very hard because

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the more benefits and this home that we created, now it's all

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our responsibility to keep it going. So your dedication

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and your work, and you're going above and beyond to every customer, and you know,

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the customers love all the peeps. You all have

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the responsibility. It isn't just a senior leadership. All of us have a

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responsibility to take care of the family. And that just

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embedded our responsibility by each individual. I

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mean, I don't know, it's hard. Everyone says, Viv, write a book. I wouldn't

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even know where to start or what to say, because it's hard to put into

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words or in writing other than it's

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just magical. And it wasn't just leadership. Every individual we brought

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in, although he brought in people right away, they got called out by

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peeps if they weren't right fit and they were out.

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If you weren't right fit and we made a mistake. Someone made a mistake hiring

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you. You were out. You were outgraciously, but you were

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out. Protect the house. You're a house. We're

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protecting that house. And I have to say, it's funny you say protect the house,

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because after which I know we'll get to, but after everything played out

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the way it did, those words haunted me for days, where I

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was like, she was telling us, we got to protect this fucking house. But they

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still do. They still do. They do, 100%. My team, they'll protect the

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house. What that house means exactly. And the house wasn't

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I think it transformed because at first when you're in Ulti, you saw

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ultimate as the house. Then when ultimate was no

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longer there, we were the house like our family was the

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house. That's the same thing

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that there are. People that have left that left

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ultimate and moved on to other companies and now

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practice the same values that you

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instilled in all of us. Yeah, life changing.

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That's the biggest compliment. Life changing. I will tell you,

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there are leaders out there today that took

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your word seriously and made

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their companies special because of

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you. Because they believed everything

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that you taught us and ingrained in us. And

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I recently read a post where they called you the

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Ultimate Mother because you were like a mom to all of

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us at some point, right? Good the good, the bad, the

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ugly. You took us under your

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wings and made us the people we are

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today. I started way back in 2008,

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and I recently retired and moved on to another

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company. But I took on everything that I learned from you guys,

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everyone. And I instilled that in my day to day

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life, and I'm fortunate to work for a company now that has those

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same values. It's like a very tiny mini ultimate

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software. But when I was looking

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after retirement, I was looking for a place that was

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more about culture than it was about money, and I

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found that. And I'm so forever grateful for you. That makes me

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happy. You have no idea

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how grateful I am to you and to ultimate and to

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all my friends. I have friends that care, lifelong friends now. I mean, dirty

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skittles. And I wouldn't be doing this podcast if it wasn't for

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Mean. This is kind of our way of giving

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back. Yeah, but the same thing for me. The

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only friends I have in my life are pete's, my best friend,

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came out of Ulti with Cecil, my sister I never had Debbie. It's a

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sister to me. The amount of friendships, of bonds and relations I

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have, those who have gone, who are still there, it's like my

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happiness. Remember?

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Let me cry again from a little girl

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who didn't feel loved. To create a

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place where I'm so overly loved.

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Put yourself in my place. How overwhelming

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that my heart was. So how could I not give

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back to these people who loved ultimate, who loves God, who

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loved the leadership? Like, that love there. But I know it's

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like the same thing. I was put on this Earth, and I think

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Scott and I were brought together on this Earth to create

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ultimate. I can't even imagine what it

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would have been if Scott would not have brought me in. We

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talked about it several times. Like, it would have been a mess.

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But the fact again, I'm a big believer of care and the energies of the

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universe. I'm not a religious person. I'm very spiritual. But

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the fact that I was laid off and the

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data I'm laid off, I have lunch with a man who lets me create

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ultimate the way I wanted to, because I could have been a

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fucking CEO. Who there's a lot of HR professionals out

00:14:06
there who the CEO don't let them do anything. I've talked to many customers

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who I've presented to. They say I want to do. He goes, like, Viv, you

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just convinced me that I'm in the wrong company because my CEO doesn't let me

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do anything of this. I'm like, yeah, then life is too short. You should leave.

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But to have that blessing that scott didn't question

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anything I did, had no clue what I was doing. I said, we're going to

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roll out IVF. He goes, all right, good. Doesn't know what IDF is. He doesn't

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know our benefits. So every time he talked to A to talk, you wanted to

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call Trim better. You got to talk to we all. He was clear on what

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his role was. I was very clear on what my role was. And all the

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leaders knew exactly what they had to do. But the fact that I had that

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liberty and that gift, that I can do whatever I wanted to do

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at ultimate and give that back and

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do that for people who were so amazing and dedicated.

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Brilliant people. Everyone we brought in was they added so much to the

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business. And then on top of that, even if they weren't, and

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I had so many people who said, I never, ever thought about giving so much

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to charity or participating. It feels good. But

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everything we create, even if we challenges mindset on either

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women or the gay community or

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on Made, we were so

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vocal and transparent what our values were

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and what we believed in. That new hire, and I told it very clearly, a

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new hire, this is what we believe in. And I went through a 30 minutes

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spiel on my communities of service. I said, if you don't support this, if you

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don't believe that, then this is not the place for you. And that's okay. But

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you should leave, because we need to bring people who are going to believe in

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this and who are going to make us stronger.

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Don't stay here if this is not what you believe. For a paycheck with the

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benefits, don't do that because you're not doing us any benefits, then leave. But

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I made it very clear, and I think when that tone is from the top,

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from the very beginning, it makes an awareness

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in the same thing. We went to so much of LGBT, and

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I cannot tell you that countless emails and hugs have gone from people,

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by the way, and this was before I knew my kids were gay. Both of

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them. I'm like, oh, my God, you

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got to be kidding me. Because I had no clue. So I did all this

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stuff because the same thing, it goes back to the humanity of

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everyone is everyone has something to contribute, and

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everyone deserves to be loved. It doesn't care what color, how you look, what

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your religion, or who do you love. Like, who fucking

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cares? We're all people here on this earth, and

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we don't know how long we're here. Life is very short. But don't hate.

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There's no hate at ultimate. There was never any hate involved, and we

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just didn't tolerate anyone who there was injustice.

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And if I got a complaint about

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someone, by the way, in my 30 years, now I think of it, I never

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got anything. I got a lot of employee relations issues, but never one

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who an LGBT person came to me and said

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they got a comment. That wasn't never once in 30

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years. I got other stuff, so I got sexual harassment shit,

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obviously, men suck, but never about

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gender. Or it wasn't about that. Everyone just

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felt welcome. And I think I always focused more on

00:17:24
that underdog or that marginalized person. And I wanted to make sure

00:17:27
I intentionally went after that, intentionally focused on

00:17:31
those marginalized and said, we'll take you. And that had to be the

00:17:35
secret sauce, man. That had to be the secret sauce. And it

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showed every single day, every single day that I showed up

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for work. Like I said, I'd never felt so

00:17:46
loved being able to be so open and never

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felt like I needed to hide who I was because it wasn't going to

00:17:53
happen. Because by then, a lot of people had families who

00:17:57
they're going to go to, but I wanted to make sure they could come to

00:18:00
us. You're safe here, and you're loved here, and you belong

00:18:03
here. But again, I think that maybe it's me. I don't

00:18:07
know. I think humans should be no. Well,

00:18:11
I mean, I can't comprehend how anyone would not be like that.

00:18:14
It's just hard for me when I. Say it has to be you. I think

00:18:19
you could tap into the good in

00:18:22
people, and I think that that's a

00:18:26
uniquely skill set that you had in the group of individuals starting

00:18:30
ultimate. So I think you could pick up

00:18:34
on who are the right people and give them a chance. And I think

00:18:37
that's where the secret sauce is. And so for the listeners that don't

00:18:41
know Ultimate Software weren't fortunate enough to work for Ultimate Software,

00:18:45
it may sound like this wonderful place to be, and it truly

00:18:49
was. I can't think of a bad day I had there. We all trusted each

00:18:53
other. We felt empowered. We felt welcomed. So

00:18:56
sitting where we are today, ultimate Software is no

00:19:00
longer. Can you tell us how you went from

00:19:05
having this love and how fulfilling that was to then where

00:19:09
you are now? Because it couldn't have been an easy ride.

00:19:14
Yeah, it was probably one of the hardest things I've been through, and I've been

00:19:17
through two divorces. It

00:19:21
almost broke me for several reasons.

00:19:25
I knew towards the end, after 30 years, A, I knew

00:19:29
I didn't want to die at my desk. I know Scott wanted out.

00:19:33
He was tired. I was tired. I also felt like I had nothing else to

00:19:37
accomplish. I loved our

00:19:40
people, but business wise, I was like,

00:19:44
I didn't feel anymore. And I knew my daughter was trying to get

00:19:48
pregnant. And I knew that I was just wanting to dedicate to

00:19:51
my grandchild. And plus, I was just tired.

00:19:55
And I didn't have a drive anymore.

00:19:58
Like, best place to work. It just

00:20:02
didn't drive. It's been 30 years of me driving and driving and driving and

00:20:05
driving. I loved it, but I felt very complacent at that

00:20:09
point, and I know Scott was super tired. Anyway, long story

00:20:13
short, h and F came to us the end of

00:20:16
2018, early 2019, really hard pressed

00:20:20
by us and me and my naive mind.

00:20:24
Um, H and Scott in the early talking, and we started talking to H

00:20:28
and F. And it's funny because I knew higher orientation was the first time I

00:20:31
met H and F group, and it was a group of, like, ten guys, and

00:20:33
I had no idea who they were. I said, Where are the women here? Why

00:20:36
aren't there any women here? They're all guys. And then I find out, fuck. It

00:20:40
was H and F. I don't give a fuck.

00:20:44
You know, when Scott started saying, oh, yeah, we're going to

00:20:48
go private, and he had this whole talk, scott, I know, was tired.

00:20:53
His logical next step was to make Adam CEO. So he was going to be

00:20:57
co CEO because Scott didn't want to take on anymore. I know he was physically,

00:21:00
mentally, emotionally, all of us. We were nonstop. Our

00:21:04
private lives was and so

00:21:08
they came to him and they said, we want to go private. And I said,

00:21:10
oh, great, we're going to go private. I mean, the stock was soaring.

00:21:13
Yeah, it was just insanity. Especially

00:21:17
someone where we went out at $10, and I saw the stock go at $2.

00:21:21
So like, this is insane. How does this happen? This is crazy.

00:21:26
So he says, no, we're going to go private. I'm thinking, oh, great. And then

00:21:29
I don't beco we'll private. But in my mind, naive mind,

00:21:32
I thought, well, we'll go public now. We're going to go private. Meaning we're just

00:21:35
not on Nasdaq anymore. I didn't comprehend

00:21:39
that we were selling our company. So Scott, we're talking. We could

00:21:43
talk to H F. They brought a whole team together. What else? I knew already

00:21:46
that if we want to go, I'm I'm done. I actually said, I'm Scott, I'm

00:21:50
done. Because Issa is now my daughter's pregnant. She gives birth in

00:21:53
October. Like, I'm done. I brought Kathleen. I said, we

00:21:57
need to look for Chief People officer. So in March, at Connections,

00:22:01
I told h f like, I'm leaving. So Scott's plan

00:22:04
was, I'm going to stay for a year, year and a half,

00:22:08
and then I'll transition. Said, Perfect. You know, you stay. You can do

00:22:12
it. I'm out. And then when he said, we're going private, I said,

00:22:16
we're having conversations. We're going private. And he goes, yeah, they're buying us for 11

00:22:19
billion. I said, well, what do you mean they're buying us? Because no, we're selling

00:22:23
the company. I said, what do you mean we're selling the company? It was just

00:22:26
a naive I didn't know what he was talking about. I thought we were just

00:22:29
not going to be Nasdaq. And I just started bawling. I

00:22:33
just started crying. I broke because I felt like,

00:22:37
what do you mean you're selling our like, again, it's a baby

00:22:41
to him. And said, Viv, if you don't

00:22:44
want to sell it, I won't do it.

00:22:48
But I knew that was the only way we could leave.

00:22:52
So it took me about two weeks to compose myself crying.

00:22:56
And then the suit and the guilt because nobody knows anything. And the guilt

00:23:00
of telling doing new hire, oh, we're great. Knowing what's going in, my

00:23:03
heart was breaking. Like, we got to get this done. I can't do this anymore.

00:23:07
So my team was the first one I told. Anyway, long story

00:23:11
short, I was leaving at the end of the year,

00:23:15
December 2019. And Scott says, I told H and F, I'm not staying here either.

00:23:19
I'm not doing it. He couldn't stay. I wasn't there. Whatever. As

00:23:22
if I'll both leave then Mark was leaving, but Mark already had a foot out

00:23:25
the door. Mark was nowhere to be seen anyway, so we

00:23:29
laughed, which was the last new heart was so

00:23:33
emotional. It was an emotional departure, but I

00:23:37
knew still, I still felt I'm leaving, but

00:23:41
I'm still here. I'm coming back and I'm seeing all my people and I'm

00:23:45
still going to be involved. Pandemic happens.

00:23:49
So now I leave, right? The pandemic is happening. So

00:23:52
no, no one's going to see anybody. On top of that, I

00:23:56
break up with Scott in March of to 1020 because I

00:24:00
knew the bond that kept Scott and I together was ulti.

00:24:03
We had personal issues and I knew I wasn't

00:24:07
being loved the way I wanted to be loved. But it's okay because I had

00:24:10
ultimate and I had my people who loved me. So I didn't feel loved by

00:24:14
Scott. And he's a great man. I admire him, I respect him. I will always

00:24:18
love him. But he wasn't capable of love

00:24:21
me the way I needed to be loved. But I found that at

00:24:24
ultimate. So it was my people. So now I left

00:24:28
ultimate. We're in the middle of pandemic. I'm not seeing people hugging people.

00:24:32
I've left Scott. I got to leave Boca and find a house. There's

00:24:35
nothing real estate because no one's showing their houses. And now my daughter

00:24:39
and my five month old granddaughter are living with me. So I got it.

00:24:45
I reached a really low place in my

00:24:49
life where I had this child that I had for

00:24:53
30 years and I felt I was the queen of the

00:24:56
kingdom where everybody loved me and I felt the love and it

00:25:00
was again, it goes back to the trauma of feeling loved, to not feeling loved

00:25:03
at all. Here I am to that little girl crying

00:25:07
again and not feeling loved again.

00:25:11
And I was going a lot expressing my stuff to my daughter and I thought

00:25:15
that wasn't fair. And I've never cried so much every

00:25:18
night. I cried myself to sleep every night by myself, just cry

00:25:22
and cry. And then the things that went on through my head

00:25:26
of ultimate and the guilt that I felt then

00:25:30
leaving ultimate now, as soon as we left, they

00:25:33
announced the merger. Like, what have we done? It was

00:25:37
that guilt that I know he's felt it, but I'll only speak for

00:25:41
me, but of I fucked everybody.

00:25:45
Look what we did. These people came to ultimate that they were

00:25:49
not going anywhere else other than ultimate. They were going to retire.

00:25:53
Look what we've done. Was it selfish of

00:25:57
us to not want to do this anymore? It wasn't about the money

00:26:01
because we didn't need more money. But look what we did

00:26:05
to these people. We've changed

00:26:09
their lifestyles. Like we've impacted their lives

00:26:12
and not in a good way. So here I am, someone who's a people pleaser.

00:26:16
So the guilt of seeing what's slowly

00:26:20
trickling and happening and not hearing good

00:26:23
things, never in my mind would I have thought that

00:26:27
it would happen like it happened. It was an adjustment, fine. But

00:26:30
then I started. I mean, every till this day, every time I hear of a

00:26:34
layoff, it just got me crying.

00:26:40
So what I can say, Viv, is that you can't take this

00:26:44
on your own. Because the lessons that you

00:26:48
taught all of us, literally in the 15 years that

00:26:51
I worked at ultimate and I will keep

00:26:55
saying this, you taught us how to protect

00:26:59
our house, how to protect us, how to protect our team,

00:27:03
our friends, our family. And to this day, that

00:27:06
still happens. They took every single word that

00:27:10
you said to heart and every single day,

00:27:14
the people that came from ultimate still preach

00:27:17
that protect this house. And they're protecting each other, their

00:27:21
teams, everything. I

00:27:25
know you feel guilty, but don't. Because you taught all of us.

00:27:30
I can tell you there's no blame.

00:27:33
Right. I don't want you to think that

00:27:37
anybody holds ill will. Right?

00:27:40
I know. But it doesn't help me. Still feeling

00:27:44
that? Yeah. So I said, I need

00:27:47
help. I need help. I need someone to talk to

00:27:51
me. Because the same thing. I felt so powerful because I

00:27:55
was able to do so much for people. I just felt powerless.

00:27:58
I felt like question, what's my purpose? Now I have a beautiful

00:28:02
five month old granddaughter, which I love. And God, I love that little girl who

00:28:06
saved me. But what's my purpose? Is this it? I'm 57

00:28:10
years old, 58 years old, turned in January. Is this

00:28:14
it? I went from being at the

00:28:17
top of now, managing all these people and loving all these people like I have

00:28:21
nothing. I felt like I had nothing. And again, it

00:28:25
goes back to me needing to be loved.

00:28:29
I didn't have that. So I went to therapy for a year and a

00:28:32
half, where it probably took a year and a half for me to stop feeling

00:28:36
guilty about what happened

00:28:40
to the beats of me dealing with Scott and I,

00:28:43
separation with an 18 year relationship,

00:28:47
questioning why, why did I stay? Was there a

00:28:51
lot of anger, a lot of resentment? So I had to heal through

00:28:54
that and also a sense of responsibility. Now I have my daughter

00:28:58
and now I have two grandkids and her wife now living

00:29:01
with me. Now. I'm on my own again. And

00:29:06
that's just that adjustment up. It's life. So my therapist says, viv, can we

00:29:09
talk about everything that you've gone through and look how great you've done. But I

00:29:13
kept telling her like, yeah, but I feel like I should be doing something. And

00:29:16
then on top of that a people finding out that I

00:29:19
love Scott and it was like, oh my god, I can't believe you left Scott

00:29:23
and he's so great. He is great, but he wasn't

00:29:27
great for me. He's a great guy. He's not great for

00:29:30
me at good times, but he just couldn't love me the way

00:29:34
but it's hard because everyone had this image of Scott and Viv, scott and Viv.

00:29:38
So that was hard to do. And then I had a lot of pressure feeling

00:29:41
from people like well, Viv, what are you going to do now? Or what are

00:29:44
you going to do now? I'm like, I don't know what I'm going to do.

00:29:47
I've done all these for 30 years. But you know, for anyone who's

00:29:51
retired, fully retired, it's hard, especially what you've been and it's

00:29:55
not just me, it's happened. Anybody who's

00:29:58
had their own company or they did this or this was their passion and then

00:30:02
it's gone. So it was so much adjustment where I just hit

00:30:05
rock bottom, where it's a lot of crying, a lot of loneliness,

00:30:09
a lot of who am I? Because I know my identity is not Viv from

00:30:13
ultimate software. I am also just viv.

00:30:16
But for 30 years you identify as Viv from ultimate software. So that's

00:30:20
hard now, ultimate so it's taken me a year

00:30:24
and a half of my therapy with an amazing therapist and I think he is.

00:30:28
And it was hard because it was hard for me also to be very vulnerable

00:30:31
and honest about what I was feeling because she knew also my

00:30:35
story about ultimate software. So it was hard to say this is what I'm

00:30:39
feeling. I feel like nothing. I feel like I have no purpose.

00:30:43
I feel like what do I do now? Is this my life? Like I have

00:30:46
nothing now. So she was great in

00:30:50
comforting and reiterating and also delving into

00:30:54
a lot of learning a lot why I was that people pleaser.

00:31:00
Why was I such a people pleaser understanding now I understand why I was

00:31:03
people pleaser because I wanted to be loved. Because I didn't have that growing

00:31:07
up. I also too, I learned a lot about

00:31:10
setting boundaries because my son and I also had a fallout during the

00:31:14
pandemic where again we deal with anxiety different

00:31:17
ways. And I also learned too that I didn't set

00:31:20
boundaries with those closest to me because I was fear

00:31:24
of losing know I lost my mom. So it was

00:31:28
again because I needed to be loved. Like I'm not going to tell anything to

00:31:31
my daughter or my son or even Scott that this bothered me

00:31:34
because they might not love me now. So if I say

00:31:38
so, but that's so bad because I think it just builds

00:31:42
resentment. And many times with my even, especially my

00:31:46
like, I get to a point that you just take me to the top, even

00:31:49
with Scott that I just blew up. I just blow, I

00:31:52
just blow because it's like you fill a balloon, you fill a balloon, you fill

00:31:55
a balloon. And I've learned so much through

00:31:59
therapy that it's okay to have boundaries with those you love

00:32:03
and they're not going to stop loving you because you say, you know, what you

00:32:06
said really hurt me. And now I've learned so much and I

00:32:10
feel so much better with myself not to have that

00:32:14
resentment, not to build. And when my son, I learned that a lot because through

00:32:17
the years he hurt me a lot unintentionally. And I just didn't

00:32:21
say anything. So then when I did blow up, it was like, you did it,

00:32:25
you did this. And this is how I feel. It's like, well, why didn't I

00:32:28
just say anything? So it was just a year and a half of

00:32:32
learning a lot about me, a year and a half of

00:32:35
survival. Here I am

00:32:39
someone who I'm employee relations. I was advising

00:32:43
everybody and it's hard being at the top because now you have no one to

00:32:46
talk to. So that's why I think therapy is so critical for those and

00:32:50
there's no shame, especially at leadership. People who don't go, everybody I think should

00:32:54
go to therapy, agree in their life. But it was

00:32:57
a lot of year and a half. I also didn't have that guilt with

00:33:01
ultimate. I feel my heart breaks every time I see

00:33:05
challenges or people losing their jobs.

00:33:08
But I also know, and it took me a long time

00:33:12
and a lot of peeps talking to me to say viv, but

00:33:16
look what we had, look what we experienced.

00:33:20
Look at the friendships we have because of that experience. There's

00:33:24
so many people that could never have experienced ultimate

00:33:27
ever in their life. So that has helped me

00:33:31
heal where I don't feel so guilty anymore. And it has been

00:33:34
the peeps

00:33:38
because they are so grateful for that

00:33:41
experience and for me too, who I have all the relationships that

00:33:45
I have and that I have 6000 people

00:33:49
that are still to me considered family,

00:33:52
that not one has ever said you guys suck, you

00:33:56
sold the company. And look, now we all got screwed. Not on the contrary. So

00:34:00
that reassurance from them and that gratefulness

00:34:04
from them has meant the world to me because it has helped me

00:34:07
heal in my guilt, feeling like why

00:34:11
did we do this? And I don't think I would have changed anything. I probably

00:34:15
wouldn't have gone private equity, maybe,

00:34:20
I don't know. But yeah, I just think again, it was

00:34:23
just a part of my healing process. Now I'm good saying, no, I'm not doing

00:34:27
anything. I'm enjoying the rest of my life. Yeah. For a long time, it wasn't

00:34:30
like, now I'm like, Fuck it. I don't have to be doing anything. I think

00:34:34
I've done enough. Yes, I think I've done enough. I'm exhausted. I

00:34:37
really want to live life because I might not be here tomorrow. So

00:34:41
that's where anybody who says, Viv, do you want to go? Yeah, but you

00:34:45
don't know where we're going. I don't care. It doesn't matter.

00:34:48
Because again, that comes to my mom, who passed away at night,

00:34:52
37. And I tell my kids and my kids like, mom, you're nonstop

00:34:56
now. You're always doing something. You're always going somewhere. I say, yeah, because I love

00:34:59
to do this now, and tomorrow is not guaranteed. They might not be here

00:35:03
tomorrow. And I know Cecil, who's been my best

00:35:07
friend, now says, you want to go to Bali? I'm like, you know what? Fuck

00:35:09
it. If not now, when? I want to go to Bali. I might not

00:35:13
be here tomorrow. So we're going to Bali in February. I got a Costa Rica

00:35:16
in three weeks with nine of us who are girls

00:35:20
who seven of us were from the Machu Picchu clan when we did 22 of

00:35:24
us with seven of us during the pandemic, the local

00:35:28
ones, there were seven of us. I said, Girls, I'm going crazy. I need to

00:35:31
see people like, let's just do a getaway the seven of us. And then

00:35:35
we added two more outside of Machu Piccho. So nine of us have done a

00:35:38
girls trip for four years now. Every year. Nice. So three

00:35:42
weeks were off to Costa Rica again, it's like those

00:35:45
relationships and that gift that all of us have gotten from

00:35:48
Ulti, it's priceless. We're never going to find that. It's not. And

00:35:52
I think for everyone, too, is they keep chasing another

00:35:55
alti. It's hard. It's never going to be another. Never going to be another one.

00:35:58
Never. It'll be close, but never be another. But think of all we got

00:36:02
because of Ulti. I know. Yeah. That's the biggest gift I got

00:36:06
from Ulti, for sure. It's all the yeah. That's this is something

00:36:10
that I will take away from this is that I think before,

00:36:13
I would probably bittersweetly think about it whenever we had a new hire that would

00:36:17
say, oh, tell us about and it was like an now.

00:36:21
And I think G Rex, I think you said it when you and I were

00:36:24
talking the other day where we're so happy that we had the

00:36:28
opportunity to work at ultimate. And I'm like thinking about it now. I'm

00:36:32
like, that's probably my favorite part of my career so far. Right.

00:36:36
That's not something I should think bittersweet on. That's almost something I'm

00:36:39
proud of now from having this conversation. It's just

00:36:43
yeah, we were lucky. I have to

00:36:47
say, Viv, that when I was going through my mental breakdown

00:36:51
and during my healing, when I reached out

00:36:54
to you, you gave me nothing but patience and grace

00:36:58
and you lifted my heart and

00:37:02
really helped me to find that inner strength.

00:37:06
And I really appreciated it. You know how I

00:37:10
said Journey Skittles was going to fangirl on you? Well, I'm going to

00:37:13
fangirl for a few minutes because when I decided

00:37:17
to take my early retirement, you were the first person I reached out to to

00:37:20
make sure that it was a good package. And part

00:37:24
of my mental breakdown was that going into

00:37:27
retirement, I'd been working for 45 years. And then I was like,

00:37:31
what the fuck am I going to do now? And

00:37:35
Hindsight is 2020. Back in October. The podcast

00:37:39
was never in my wheelhouse. And I'm so thankful that we have

00:37:43
this now because we get to share these stories with people

00:37:47
every day and we get to normalize how we talk about mental

00:37:50
health, because to me, that's super important. And the

00:37:54
lessons that you taught me, and I hold very

00:37:58
true to my heart and especially my wife. She wanted to

00:38:02
sit down on the conversation today, but she'll get to listen later on.

00:38:06
She loves you so very much and you

00:38:10
will always be a big part of my family and my heart. And you

00:38:13
were so excited when we told you we were going to Europe for three weeks.

00:38:17
I was. That was makes me so happy. And a lot of those

00:38:21
Ulti dreams that I feel like people got a chance to do, I got so

00:38:25
many emails, everyone with the stock going up and the payout and that

00:38:28
people viv. I have my oldie house and the know college paid

00:38:32
for my kids. And I see now on Instagram and social media and I see

00:38:36
people going taking these amazing, beautiful trips. And

00:38:41
that's part of my healing process, that's part that I feel

00:38:45
good about what we did versus bad about what it's become, which is still

00:38:49
not I mean, I'm not going to talk bad about UKG.

00:38:53
They do what they got to do. It's just sometimes I don't agree how they

00:38:56
do it, but there's still a lot of peeps there. And

00:39:00
the same thing of the fact that we changed so many people's lives

00:39:03
and to see so many people being able to retirement

00:39:07
alti did a lot of like, these people wouldn't have that stuff. It weren't for

00:39:11
Ulti. And the house I went to, someone like, this is the house Ulti built.

00:39:14
Look, my kids my kids life challenges. Are you kidding me? My kids

00:39:18
lives are Ulti kids. Issa was five months old and she knows

00:39:21
that if it weren't before ultimate, they don't take it for granted one

00:39:25
day because they would not have the life they have and my grandkids have their

00:39:29
life. Like, all of us had a piece of

00:39:32
alti that changed our lives forever. But again, it's not the

00:39:36
monetary things, it's just the friendships that we have. And no matter where we

00:39:40
go and to be able to do this. And I talk to Pete's

00:39:44
every week. Every week I talk to people who just check up in on me

00:39:47
or I've had trips with them. We've had dinners. I actually had dinner next

00:39:51
week with Kathleen Pi, who worked for me. And she's taken the Ulti

00:39:55
way. She's so grateful because Viv, she's taken it with her, and she's making that

00:39:59
Ulti way where she is. I mean, that's the biggest compliment that

00:40:02
I can have, that people has taken it in.

00:40:06
It is not about the leadership. Those Peeps left at

00:40:09
Alti, even whatever's happening at the top, they're still family. That Alti family is

00:40:13
still there. I don't care what anybody does. That Ulti family is still

00:40:17
there. That culture amongst the peace is still strong.

00:40:20
Nothing's ever going to change that. Nothing will ever change that. In or

00:40:24
out of Alti, that will always stay strong. And even with all the

00:40:28
layoffs just in our Ulti Peep

00:40:32
per Life group, right? You can see all these people reaching out

00:40:35
to help everybody else out, not just on Facebook, but on

00:40:39
LinkedIn and reaching out personally and checking in. And you

00:40:43
know what? You taught us that protect the house,

00:40:46
and it's instilled in me for life. No

00:40:50
matter where I go, no matter what, you know? I'm so forever

00:40:54
grateful for you. You're an amazing friend. Yeah. Thank you.

00:40:58
We just love you so much. We do.

00:41:02
Just keep being you, man. Go out there and fucking I don't. Know how to

00:41:06
be any other way. I don't know how to be any other way. If I

00:41:09
tried know I don't know how to be any other way. I

00:41:13
just don't understand when people in organizations are like,

00:41:17
just I did consulting for nine months after Ulti again,

00:41:20
thinking, I can still do this. Yeah, I can still do

00:41:24
but then I felt like, you know, I'm worklife for someone.

00:41:27
Mean, the CEO was a great guy, but

00:41:32
typical corporate America, it's like, you know what? You really don't care about your

00:41:35
people. You want a quick Band Aid and here we did this and all right,

00:41:38
that's it. They should be happy. Like, that doesn't work like that. It doesn't work

00:41:42
like that. Don't pay for their kids insurance and then

00:41:45
say, now they're happy. Okay, we're good. No, you're not good, dude.

00:41:50
It's every interaction you have with people every day.

00:41:54
Every word you may say matters, every action. It's

00:41:58
just a lot of people don't get it, and unfortunately, it's

00:42:02
sad. So I'm hoping that the Peeps take it to other places they go and

00:42:05
try to instill it is not the leadership amongst other people and try to just

00:42:09
make people fucking kinder, man. Just people will

00:42:13
respect and care for one another. Stop the hate and

00:42:16
just we don't know how long we're on this earth. And the biggest thing is

00:42:20
when we leave, you do make a difference for others. And I

00:42:24
think I have. And yeah, now it's just

00:42:27
keep enjoying ourselves and be there for each other. That's all that matters is and

00:42:31
that Pete family doesn't matter. 6000 still strong. Will always be

00:42:34
strong. Doesn't matter where we go. They're still strong. We will.

00:42:38
Thank you. We love you so much. We love you too.

00:42:42
Love you to all my peeps. Can you? I love that. Say that

00:42:46
again. Yeah, say it again without us interrupting you. Love to all my peeps.

00:42:50
Love you. Love you. Love you. Always protect the house. Love you all

00:42:54
you. You.

00:42:59
It's okay to be not okay. Just make sure you're talking to someone.