Part 2: Diandra on Workplace Mental Health, FMLA, and Building a More Human Workplace

[00:00:01] Hi all, this is part two of a two-part episode. Hey there listeners, welcome to Sh!t That Goes On In Our Heads, our podcast where we normalize conversations around mental health. That's right. I'm Dirty Skittles and alongside my amazing co-host, G-Rex, we're here to share stories and tips from our incredible guests.

[00:00:25] Each episode, we deep dive into struggles and triumphs of mental health, offering practical advice and heartfelt support because no one should feel alone in their journey. Join us as we break the stigma and build a community of understanding and compassion. Tune in and let's start talking about the shit that goes on in our heads. How do you maintain what sounds to be like a positive outlook of like, I'm gonna keep going, I'm gonna keep going like one foot in front of the other,

[00:00:55] when especially trying to talk about like helping organizations and treat people not like cogs, like that is a very difficult battle, right? Like not everybody wants to hear that message or is willing to sort of reflect on, yeah, maybe there is a problem here. So how do you keep that drive going when it's so difficult? It is difficult. Honestly, just the difference that I could make would be so overwhelming.

[00:01:23] And to get in the room to have a conversation, that's the first step. If someone's willing to listen to me and to say, maybe she's got something to say, maybe she's going to work and listen. That's all I need. I don't know how to be anything different than who I am. And that's a person who is tenacious to a fault. And I've got this mission now and I really want to make an impact.

[00:01:53] I don't know how I'm going to do it though, 30 said-a-law. I don't know how I'm going to do it. But every single day, I'm taking steps towards a goal. The goal being that we'll have some type of reform for workplace grief and workplace crisis management and loss. Because we have nothing like that. We have HR teams, yeah, but they're really in it for themselves and in it for the company.

[00:02:19] It really isn't a way that humans as workers can get the support that they need aside from the HR team. And that's problem number one. Because HR isn't your friend. Right. They're not there for you. Right. They're there for the company and they're bottom line. Right. There needs to be some type of position or some type of click based on the company for this exact thing.

[00:02:45] I don't know what I would call it, but I'm throwing some names out there. I like crisis management. Yeah. Because if any of your employees are in crisis at any moment, it affects the entire balance of everything that's going on. Yeah. Whether they realize it, whether the leaders realized it or not.

[00:03:13] But nobody takes the time because, you know, just as like we were talking, managers don't take any training on stress management. They don't take any training on how to identify burnout. They don't take any training on how to identify crisis. Yeah. In this day and age, it blows my mind. Why is it the thing, you guys? It's like, why? It's, it's so frustrating.

[00:03:43] Like I go back to my story. Like when I, when I had to step away from work, understand that at that moment, to me, I would never return. Right. Like that was, my brain was like, that's how I describe it. It was broken. I had to take a step back. And that was when I actually realized just how difficult it is. And just how much I realized to your point that the HR team was not there for me. Well.

[00:04:09] It was incredibly difficult, especially being in a place mentally where you couldn't even form a sentence to now try to navigate through. How do I prove that I'm ill enough, that I need to take a step back when it's not like I've gotten into a car accident and I, you know, I'm paralyzed. Like, no, it was, this was a mental health issue. Yes. And I didn't have a resource from this employer to walk me through. Okay. This is what you need now.

[00:04:39] Like, it's going to be okay. We got this. There was no, we got this. It was like the fact that it's called human resources is fucking bullshit. But it was very, it was very much like you are on your own. And I also think that like lead coordinators need to have some type of mental health training, crisis training, burnout training, so that they can identify.

[00:05:06] Like, how, like on the scale of like one to 10, are these people, are they good to stay here at work or 10, we need to get this person on FMLA right away.

[00:05:19] And so like, there needs to be a, an application built that can help, help them like generate what, what that is because humans on their own, no matter like how intuitive you are, you can't pick that all up on your, on your own. No. You can't. Especially if you're not mentally there. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:05:44] You guys, I, I'm glad that you said what you said, uh, G-Rex and also Dirty Skittles to your point. I was going to say FMLA was a savior for me after I committed, I tried to commit suicide, right? Because my mom ended up calling my boss and she was just like, I am DeAndra's mother.

[00:06:06] I realized that she's an adult, but she is not mentally capable right now in order to, to, you know, save herself. So I need you guys to tell me where I need to go. And luckily my boss at the time, wonderful woman, um, she was like, I will get you in contact with human resources. And she did. And from there I was able to take FMLA from there.

[00:06:32] And I was like, I've worked for like maybe three months while I got my life together and went every week to therapy. So you, you did the right thing. You did the exact right thing. But the thing is, is like, and we've talked about this on the podcast before, the number of fucking hoops that people need to go through in order to get on FEMLA is ridiculous. Yeah. Everything had a deadline. I remember that.

[00:07:00] And, and speaking with the, the, um, and like the organization and the leave coordinator, everybody's asking you for stuff. And I, I could not mentally put it together. I ended up, and I, I've shared this with friends of mine that work at this company. Like I ended up having to come out of my own pocket to pay someone to help me because the company wasn't giving me that, that, that help.

[00:07:28] So I, I ended up paying like over $2,000 for, for somebody to, um, diagnose me actually and file all of the paperwork that all these people were asking for because I couldn't do it on my own. And then I was struggling, like, I think that probably took a month. And after that was when I could breathe, like, I'm like, okay, somebody's got my back.

[00:07:52] Let me now seek the therapy and, and do the things that I should have been able to do earlier on. And it was a mess. So I hate, I hate that, um, it had to be like that for me. And I, I can only imagine what other hoops anybody else is going through. So. Yeah, it's a lot. It's so important to have these conversations. And it, it is a lot. And like, think about just be, for me, I've, I didn't, I haven't, I did not take family.

[00:08:23] Instead, I got to retire. So that was pretty much okay. But what happened, like, think about like when you guys went back to work, right? Because, you know, it's people, people are very insensitive. And for the most part, right? They, they are prying in your business. They want to know why you were out. They want to like, okay, how about none of your fucking business? That's what. I had to work through that with a therapist.

[00:08:52] Like, I was so scared that somebody was going to ask me what happened. And like, how do I tell them what happened? And her and I would literally go through exercises of like, all you have to say is I'm ready to move forward. I don't need to, like, I don't need to tell you any of this stuff. I'm here now and I'm ready to move on. And that was my script. Like, that was like, I came back, we had a team meeting. I managed this team. And that was what I said. Like, I'm not going to talk about what happened, where I was. I'm ready to move forward.

[00:09:21] And nobody ever asked me shit. I was like, oh, thank God. Thank God. Right? Like, now we can actually move on. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. It's tough. And imagine if, if I had been a people leader at that point, would I have told my team? You handled that very well. Right? Yeah. I think you did. Right. Yeah. That was what therapy was like. I'm like, cause I, when I, when I stepped away, I thought and G-Rex had heard me say it.

[00:09:50] I was like, there's no way I can go back. There was just no way. Like, mentally, I'm like, there's just no way. You know, truthfully, somebody like me, yeah, I had to go back. Right? Like, I needed insurance. I needed, like, I had adult responsibilities. And, and being on leave, I was not at a place to look for something else. Right? Like, I, I was fucked. Essentially, short term, I was fucked.

[00:10:11] So, having to go back was what we had to work through because it was like, shit, I've got to go back to this, this toxic environment until I can find something else. And, and how do you work through that? And it was tough.

[00:10:41] I was the irreverent, unlicensed therapist at that time. So, um, she got to vent to me and we got to role play and I'd be like, yeah, maybe don't use these words, but kind of like come up with something that would like work out for you. You were really good. Like, it's important to have a support system. And I was very thankful because I knew that if, if she was going to call me every day, first of all, without, without fail, she would call every day. But if I wasn't in a place to even talk, you would text me.

[00:11:11] Hey, I hope you're, I hope you're getting rest today. And that was it. She didn't ask for shit else. Nope. That was nice. I did give little nuggets of information. Yeah. Maybe get up and brush your teeth today. That would be good. Yeah, wash your face. Did you wash your face? Did you wash? Did you eat? Right. But like giving her that support system because, and everybody needs that type of support system, whether people think about it or not. Yeah.

[00:11:37] Even though they're on leave, still check in on your fucking people. Okay. Like they need human contact. Maybe they don't need to hear anything about work, but they still need human contact. And I, I don't care if that means like maybe stopping by their house and bringing them a meal or texting them and just checking in on them, making sure they're okay.

[00:12:00] And I don't think that, I know that there's rules around family where they, you know, work can't contact you and shit like that, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. When they shouldn't be. And, and if they are, then you need to turn their ass in. But, you know, you're a media manager. When they're coming back. Okay. Have they been trained on how to deal with somebody that's coming back from family?

[00:12:28] No, they have not. No. Especially if there's a fucking reason. Yeah. If they're, if they're the toxic person and then you can come back to this toxic manager who doesn't know how to deal with anything. It's like, well, Jesus. Well, it's like you can't wait for losing. God, leave. I don't know.

[00:12:52] There, there, I like what you said, uh, G-Rex about there needs to be an app or some type of program that helps people understand the steps to go through to, in order to deal with something like this. That would be awesome. Yeah. That'd be awesome. Whether, whether it's a manager or the human source resource coordinator or the lead manager. Yeah. So that people can identify. Okay.

[00:13:21] You're on a scale of like one to 10. Right. One, okay, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're going to be okay. You know, like what, here's some resources we can try and then like check back with us in a couple of weeks. If you're taking that test with them on the phone or whatever and you hit a 10, they better have like a fucking fire drill to figure out how to, how to fix this.

[00:13:47] Because if you're like, if you're, if you're, um, like a subject matter expert, right? Um, kind, I guess kind of like I was, I was a subject matter expert. Everybody came to me. If I had decided to be like, I'm checking out, people would have freaked out because I showed up to work every single day with a smile. Okay. Not my finest moment. I get it.

[00:14:13] But I showed up every single day and like, nobody knew how depressed I was. Dirty Skittles didn't know. And yes, I worked from home, but you know, people could see me on the camera every day. And like, there's no like assessment tests that are, that people are either given or can take. Right. Yeah. To help figure out like what their mental state is.

[00:14:38] Because, you know, especially now, the world is a fucking shit show. Literally. Yeah. I think everybody should be in therapy. And, um, especially, or, or at least training, I don't know, trying to better yourself. Because as I think about it too, it's difficult to want to change an entire, I guess, mindset of like a corporate mindset of like how to treat employees better.

[00:15:03] When those people like managers, directors, VPs don't even know how to deal with themselves and how to take care of their own triggers. So if you've just got like this ticking time bomb of a person, how the fuck are they going to treat their employees better? You know? Thought about that too. Training a hundred percent. If I were a director at that point in my life, I would have been the most toxic person to work for. Because I hadn't been to therapy.

[00:15:32] I hadn't gotten all the tools I needed in order to be a decent human being. All these things. And there's so many directors that I consider, you know, good colleagues and stuff. But they do not have the emotional intelligence to be leading anybody. Can't even hurt a pair of good folks. And they're trying to lead an entire team to success. Like all the way off. Like, are you kidding? People need to have emotional intelligence.

[00:16:01] It's crazy. Like what the hell? What are we doing? It's a hundred percent true. Yeah. Literally. And you know what leads to a lot of that burnout too is the misogyny and the gerrymandering and the narcissistic managers. Okay. Y'all need to check your fucking self. Okay. Like y'all need to get on this app every day. Check yourself. Okay. My misogyny is at a scale from one to 10.

[00:16:30] Or am I a narcissist on a scale from one to 5,000? Oh, let me see who I can gerrymander today. Okay. Like they, I think managers need an app or something to help fucking self-regulate before they start talking to their employees. Yeah. Man, there needs to be some sort of assessment that warrants them understanding this is what it means to be a human being. This is how you lead a team. They have to check all the boxes.

[00:16:58] There needs to be prerequisites. All kinds of stuff. Yeah. Like, oh my God. And it needs a renewal period as well. Like, we got to do this every year to make sure your shit is still on point. Oh, fuck every year. I want you to take that every goddamn day. Right? Some sort of like... Continuing education. A CE credit. Literally. Right, right. That shit needs to expire and you got to start again.

[00:17:28] Like, you can't... I did it once and I'm good for life. Like, no. No, no. You take that shit every day. Right? Yeah. Right? At least. Every week. Every week. Every month. Right. Right. I'm like, we have tests for everything. Like, you have to have a driver's license to drive. Like, there's shit and here we are just managing people or organizations and not being tested on human skills. Like, what the fuck?

[00:17:58] Because I... Yeah. Yeah, we need to come up with some type of assessment. Yeah. And I'm sure that, like, maybe somebody has, but, like, you know, we're in the age of AI now where you can build that app. You know, you go to it with an idea and you build that app and it may work, it may not work, but, like, I can think about, like, narcissistic, misogynistic assholes that I worked with.

[00:18:27] And, like, they would probably take that app and be, oh, this is stupid. Okay, listen. Then if you think it's stupid, you probably need to go to fucking therapy. Okay? Listen. You think it's stupid, we think you're stupid. I'm just kidding. That's me, Connie. Oh. Because I have had managers in my life that have been really good. Right? They care. They show up. They don't talk down to you.

[00:18:57] You know, if they need to talk to you, they at least escort you to another room. Checking in on you, like, how's your mental health? Like, I have had some of that in my career. Yeah. Now that I work for myself, I just do it for myself. I mean, like, hey, are you okay? Have you eaten today? Did you get up and walk around? Yeah. But, like, those are things that, like, people forget to do for themselves, right? Yeah.

[00:19:26] I just, I think in the world that we're working now, I will tell you that the employee, it's a job market now, is a whole lot different than it was even 10 years ago. And so, I'm looking for a job right now. Yeah. And it's the pitch. So, not only do we have the job market, right? But it is the whole idea of just physically going to work anyway, right?

[00:19:55] That everything's changed. And I'm going to say it's probably changed more over the last five to six years than it has in any other time period. Where companies are looking more at the numbers than they are at the people. They don't give a shit. They give zero shits. Like, zero. But, you know, we... Yeah. We need to change. The pendulum needs to swing back.

[00:20:19] And I think a lot of it has to do with just the current environment that the world is in right now. It's a fucking shit show. And, like, you know, employers aren't hiring. And if they are hiring, there's a good chance that they're going to be laying off in, like, the next five to six months. You know, AI has now come into the picture. Everybody thinks they're going to lose their jobs. Listen, people, I will tell you, I'm a huge proponent for AI. You're not going to lose your job.

[00:20:49] It still needs a human behind the keyboard. But, you know, just the scare tactics and the fear that these employers are putting on their employees is not fucking helping. Yeah. It's not. It's not. They're doing their employees a disservice every single time. Every single time. It's like they don't care. Like what you said, they don't give a fuck about you. They don't. Right.

[00:21:19] You're just a number. Right. That's brutal. It's right. Everybody out for their, you know, they're out for themselves. They're not out for anybody else. They are very self-serving. And so, like, as men. Okay. So, it's just the three of us, right? Three women thinking about this. And thankfully, I'm never going to work for corporate America ever again. Yeah. Stay it, girl. Stay it. Yeah. Yeah, that shit is never happening.

[00:21:49] But, like, how do you guys want to see that workplace change? Like, what are the things that you want to see start coming into play so that we can try and get that pendulum to swing back? Like, and it's going to take more. It's not stuff that we can. Yeah.

[00:22:10] I immediately go to, I wish, like, if there was one thing I can change first, knowing how long I think the real change would take. Like, I think in my, in the company I'm with, less pressure to perform more because they've laid off, right? We've laid off however much percentage of the workforce. Now the metrics are harder to hit.

[00:22:40] We need you to do more. And it's like, what the hell? Right? Like, you, like, it's so fucking backwards to say, I'm going to lay off a bunch of people. Guess what? Yeah. Yeah, I guess what? Now you have all of this responsibility. Like, the current org is, they've laid off, this is a true fucking story. They've laid off an entire team of people who are actually on a transition period.

[00:23:06] So during their transition period, they have to train their replacements who are overseas. So think about the mental health of that employee. Yeah, like, they don't care about the employee's mental health at all. You're not only saying that you're going to let go of them, but now you're saying that skill set you took years to master. Yeah. The fucking skill set you took years to master that you were really good at, now you have to give it to somebody else.

[00:23:36] And then say goodbye. Cool. It's like, what the fuck is happening in this goddamn place? So I wish that wasn't the world I was in. It is. But, you know, we do have the opportunity to right the ship, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah.

[00:24:05] I think that we, in like, maybe two years, things might get a little bit better, hoping, or even maybe in five months. Mm-hmm. But, like, we need to start, you know, helping, number one, employees find their voices, right? Because they don't know how to voice that they are burned out, stressed out, that they're grieving. They don't have that voice. So we need to help employers, employees find that voice.

[00:24:33] And the second part of that is, like, managers, team leads, CEOs, whatever. They all need to be trained. How do you work with an employee, or how do you help an employee that is either stressed out, burned out, or grieving? Like, what do we have in place for that? And then the third place for that is implementing that plan. Yeah. We don't have any money. I mean, fuck.

[00:25:03] I'm, like, trying to, like, even, like, simplify what you're saying even more in my brain, where it's, like, it's hard to, like, speak up and be vulnerable if you don't feel safe. Mm-hmm. And so, like, just having some way to make employees feel safe or, fuck, just the training. We go back to training. Everybody needs therapy. Everybody needs to be trained. Yeah. But, like, who's preparing that training? Even resources?

[00:25:33] Right? Maybe. Yeah. Yeah. But what's your fear that they would say? I'm telling you, nine times out of ten, it's going to come back and say, we don't have the money to do that. No, they're going to say, we already have an EAP, an employee resource center, whatever the fuck they call it. You can call that number on the back of your fucking Cigna card, whatever card you have. That shit, it's just an automated phone tree that takes you to a bottomless pit of hell. It's nothing.

[00:26:03] Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Seriously. Yeah, I tried that. Didn't work. Told you. And then I even tried through our insurance to try to get help through the insurance because you think that that's the right thing to do. Yeah, that's the right thing. And they sent me to an addiction. Yeah, they were like, oh, here's your therapist I met. It was an addiction specialist. And I was like, what the fuck? I don't have a problem with substances. I was like, fuck. I'm really out here on my own on this shit, ain't I? No.

[00:26:33] I really was not. I remember this whole conversation. Yeah, the guy was like, are you sure there's not something that you're... I'm like, what the fuck is happening here? Goddamn. Dude. It really had me out there. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry that was your experience. That's so... It was brutal. But I've been there and do that. But it's the same... Mm-hmm.

[00:26:59] It's the same experience that men and women go through every single day. And I think... I'm just going to take a guess here, though. I think that it's probably harder for men to admit that they are stressed out, burned out, and grieving, and that they need to take some time away. I think it's harder for them because there's still so much shame and so much stigma.

[00:27:25] So if anybody out there that is listening to this and you happen to be a man, there's no shame and there's no weakness in asking for help. Absolutely zero shame. Right? Like, get the help that you need. Take that time away from work. Get your... And get yourself right. Because if your mental health is all fucked up, you are not going to be able to work right at all. Yeah. There's no shame in stepping away. None.

[00:27:55] None. Okay. I have two questions for you. Uh-oh. First question is, if you could go back in time to a younger version of yourself and give that younger version some advice, what would you tell yourself and how old are you when you go back? Oh, my God. This is a question from hell. Um... Wait till... Wait till... Okay, okay.

[00:28:22] We're gonna do a little study because I want to see how she answers your questions to your ex after. Okay. You do that. Hold on. All right. I'm ready. Okay. I'm gonna be 16 years old. And I'm gonna tell myself, it gets better. Things will get better. That's what I will tell myself. Because at 16, I was chubby.

[00:28:51] I was in high school. My sister was popular. I wasn't... I was just a nerd. I did not fit in. And if I could tell myself at 16 that you're gonna be like this fashionista, wonderful woman with a great career and all this stuff, she would have been like, what? Are you kidding? Yeah. I would tell her that things will get better. That's it. Okay. I love that. I love that so much.

[00:29:20] The second question I have for you is, what would you say has been the hardest lesson that you've had to learn in your life so far? Losing people won't kill you. I thought losing my mom would have killed me. I thought it would have killed me. But it really didn't. It made me appreciate her and the love and just our lives together.

[00:29:49] I've got this tattoo on my wrist and my twin has it too. And it is the number of days our mom was with us. And that number, because we're twins, that number is the same. It's 16,282. That's how many days that's happened. That's beautiful. Yeah. I love that. Yeah. Aw. I'm putting that in my mental note.

[00:30:19] I'll recreate that tattoo one day. I'm sure you will. Do it. I will. All right. So now my question. If your anxiety had a theme song, what is it and why? My anxiety had a theme song, what would it be and why? My anxiety.

[00:30:47] I think it would have to be, I always feel like somebody's watching me. Nice. Okay. I don't know who sings it though. I can't think of the title of it. I think it's, I only think. You know that song? It almost sounds like Michael Jackson, but I don't think it is. Yeah. It's almost Michael Jackson, but it's not. I cannot think of his name. It's not. But it was awesome. Right. He sounds just like him in that. Yeah.

[00:31:16] I know exactly what you're talking about. He does. All right. And so now my next question is, what's your favorite word? Circumvent. Ooh. Ooh. Okay. Yeah. All right. It is. And what's your least favorite word? Circumvent. I know that's a two word hype in it. Cannot. But I hate saying I can't do something.

[00:31:46] I hate that word so much. I can't want that. What do you mean you can't want that? Of course you can want it. I want it. Just want it. Right. Right. I want it. I just want to say thank you so much for joining us today. This was such an enlightening conversation. Like what a way to close out of Saturday for us. This was... I feel like I can breathe.

[00:32:15] I'm drinking some tea or some gin or like a pot toddy or some shit. Because we've just been talking all day. I know. I was like, I'm going to lose my voice before this shit's over. Like I was coughing. I was done. Girl, I'm drinking my Mountain Dew. That is gross. Whatever. What flavor is that? What flavor is that? Cherry. And you know what? We're all going to die of something. All right? So yours is Mountain Dew. I'm drinking antifreeze. We're good. But I just wanted to say thank you. Thank you.

[00:32:44] Thank you so much. Awesome, Gretchen. Thank you so much. You guys are so awesome. Thank you. Hi, all. Thank you so much for listening to this episode. I'm G-Rex. And I'm Dirty Skittles. Don't forget to subscribe, rate, and review this podcast. We'd love to listen to your feedback. We can't do this without you guys.

[00:33:15] It's okay to be not okay. Just make sure you're talking to someone. We'll see you next time.