Empowering Your Mind: Alicia Hopkins on Anxiety, Growth, and Finding Your Path

[00:00:06] Hey there, listeners. Welcome to Shit That Goes Under Our Heads, the podcast where we normalize conversations around mental health. That's right. I'm Dirty Skittles and alongside my amazing co-host, G-Rex, we are here to share stories and tips from our incredible guests. Each episode, we deep dive into struggles and triumphs of mental health, offering practical advice and heartfelt support. Because no one should feel alone in their journey. Join us as we break the stigma and build a community of understanding and compassion.

[00:00:35] Tune in and let's start talking about the shit that goes on in our heads. Three, two, one. Welcome back to another episode of Shit That Goes On In Our Heads. I have my amazing co-host, Dirty Skittles, and our amazing guest, Alicia. Welcome, welcome, welcome to our podcast. Thank you. So happy to be here. Yay! I'm happy to have you. I'm very excited to hear a little bit more about you.

[00:01:04] What makes Alicia Alicia? So, I mean, that's pretty broad, right? What are you comfortable sharing with our listeners? Oh, man. Well, I guess what makes Alicia is that there is no other me, right? I'm super freaking unique. We all are, I guess. Literally. My mom tells me that all the time. Yeah, it's like everybody has their own, like, in my household, we, it's from a movie.

[00:01:31] It's not like something we created, but we like, like, Alicia-ness, Elijah-ness, like, just a little sprinkle of you, right? You can say, like, someone could, you know, sell something that I made, but they won't have the Alicia-ness on it, right? So it's like, you gotta have your own little spice. And once you figure that out, you're like, ooh, the world's so much easier. Yeah, okay. I need to work on that then. Yeah, Dirty Skiddle. It's 2025. Get out, get with the program. Yeah, get some rest. Get some rest.

[00:02:00] Sleep, number one thing. I get eight hours of sleep every night. No, I'm just kidding. I'm pretty sure I was, like, running on, like, four hours last night, because I straightened my hair for the first time in, like, over, it's been, like, two years. And it took me so fucking long to do. Yeah, how long did it take? Like, two and a half. It took me, I took a lot of breaks this time because I'm much more mentally healthy than I was the last time I did this. So I was like, but you don't have to do this all in one sitting. I mean, it took me, like, low key.

[00:02:29] It took me a long time because I had to, like, wash my hair, condition my hair. I did a deep condition, and then I had to blow dry it. Well, I let it towel off for, like, 30 minutes, then I blow dried it. And then I had to take another break because I was, like, dying. And so, you know, then you straighten one side, then you do the under. So, I mean, it really took me, like, almost, like, three and a half hours, probably almost four. Yeah, I have super curly hair. Yeah.

[00:02:53] And I'm going to say this with not my full chest, but I keep trying to tell myself this is going to be the year where I embrace my curls. No, ma'am. No, ma'am. No, ma'am. Let me tell you, this is just sorry, G-Rex, to, like, derail real quick. But we are redoing my home office, right? Hmm. That sounds real fancy, guys. It's just a room that we don't use. So we're redoing my home office. And my husband gives me this planer tool that, like, plugs into the wall.

[00:03:23] And he's like, because we've ripped it down to the studs, FYI. Oh, wow. And there's glue on the studs. So he's like, take this planer tool and, like, take the glue off the studs. I'll be back. And I'm like, ooh, you're, there's a lot of trust in our relationship at this moment. So I take the planer tool, turn it on, fire away. Wood chips fly everywhere. Embracing curly hair. Have you ever gotten wood chips and curly hair? Shit's not coming out, buddy.

[00:03:51] Like, I'm like, what the fuck? Like, it is dug down deep. And you don't even see it because my curls are so tight that I'm like, what? Like, shaking it is making it worse. Anyways, all that to tell you that I feel you on the amount of hair. Yes! And you're right. And you know what? Like, I've been on my natural hair journey for a super long time. And like, kudos to those hair people out there creating some good things for our hair.

[00:04:17] Because I grew up in the 90s and my mom tried to put oil in my hair, which if you know what that is, you know how fucking terrible it is. So yeah, that's all we had. And now we have like a million bajillion choices. And these are like literally the conversations I have with my clients. Like, yes, we have some evolved like therapy conversations too. But we're being a clinician of color, working with people of color, like it is not easy to find a safe space to talk about your hair with somebody who like totally gets it.

[00:04:43] And who's like, I have a client who's, you know, and it's so much for us black women. Like it's a journey of self-confidence as well. It's like such a powerful thing to love your hair because I grew up hating my curly hair and feeling like if it was frizzy, it wasn't a good hair day. Like if it was too voluminous and now everyone's like, how do you get more volume? I'm like, what? Like my hair is in like, okay. And I have a client who's like on this journey of like learning her natural hair.

[00:05:11] And it has been incredible to see how it's transformed like her confidence and her ability to just like stand 10 toes down on the coup she is and what she wants to look like. I have two clients who have like gone completely natural and just like loved the process and the journey and like, it's really cool. And like, you see how much it is connected to like who we are and like how we want to present ourselves and how we feel comfortable in our own skin.

[00:05:36] So it is genuinely like so important to like find this comfort zone of like, what do you want your hair to look like? Like when I straighten my hair, I'm like, this is a different version of me. Like I am a really new person. So you're seeing Alicia with straight hair today and you don't know what's going to happen. I haven't seen her a couple years. So let's see. I'm with you on this. Yeah. I, God, one day I'll get there. I do see like, TikToks of like the curly haircuts and like just embracing your curl.

[00:06:06] And I'm like, man, I want it because it would be so much more freeing to not have to spend hours upon hours every other day or every like me every five to seven days to straighten it out again. And it's just like, why? You know what I mean? And my husband loves my curls. I hate that they're tight. They're super, super tight because I have Puerto Rican and Italian and my mom's got Dominican on her. I mean, it's just girl is a tight girl and it's frizzy, but my husband loves it.

[00:06:35] And yeah, so I'm with you on that. How do you get your clients though to be a little bit more comfortable with who they are? Yeah, I think like genuinely, I was thinking about this just the other day because I think one of the biggest tools I use as a therapist is like our relationship in our sessions is like really authentic.

[00:06:54] And I have to make sure I'm showing up very authentic and I realized like a lot of what I work with my clients too is like just modeling healthy behavior and like modeling not being okay and just like modeling how to like work through that. And also like within our relationship, it's the idea of like I'm allowed to make mistakes and also hold myself accountable. Like I have not had zero client conflicts.

[00:07:20] Like I've had plenty, but I don't lose clients over conflict because naturally as a therapist, I'm quite good at working through conflict and I'm okay with being wrong. And I'm okay with being like, you know what? You're right. Like let's hunker down on this or let's focus on this or I didn't fill out this paperwork, right? Whatever it may be. Right. So I think a lot of it has to do with just like that alishiness, right? Just being myself like is really what brings my clients into trusting me and building that relationship.

[00:07:48] Genuinely like allows them to just feel like they have like this massive support system. And when you have support, it's like shocking how your life changes, right? Like, oh, like this one person believes in me when I'm at my worst and like wants to be there for me no matter what. And like will answer my texts and like respond to my emails and show up and be there for me and like be in the thick of it and go through conflict with me and not judge me and not hate me because of what I said. Like, hell yeah. I'll fucking I'll take a risk on myself.

[00:08:17] You know, like it's just that the ability to build that bond that they trust like changes their lives. And I it happened to me when I was a kid. It happens to people all over the place. Like when you have somebody who's just reaching out to you, who's like, I see you before you can see you like, wow. Like it just it can really encourage people to want to step into that. And like I talk about with a lot of my clients, I'm always like you're in a box.

[00:08:44] You're in the tiny box and like, bro, like I don't know if you've met you, but like you're too big for the box. Like your personality, you know, if you buy with me, you're probably got a big personality like that little tiny box that you're putting yourself in. And so like we got to get you out of that to be able to figure out what are you even like and then we can start to figure out, you know, if you like that and if you don't. Okay, what do we want to change? What do we want to keep, you know, like just giving them the opportunity to explore is like so huge in a safe environment.

[00:09:11] Like it changes people's lives 100%. That's key feeling safe, because if you don't, you're immediately closed off. You're not willing to be vulnerable. And I feel like at least for me, that's when I learned the most about myself. Or at least if I'm not learning it from scratch, I'm remembering who I was is when I feel safe and when I am being vulnerable. So I feel you on that. And my favorite therapist ever was genuine.

[00:09:39] So I think there's something there to having a genuine connection instead of, you know, meeting with somebody who's like robotic and not willing to. I don't know, share an emotion or laugh with you. Like, I think I've shared that with G-Rex. Like I my least favorite thing is when it's no it should be no shock that through pain I need to find humor to get through it. Right. Like we have this podcast, like we laugh about dark shit all the time.

[00:10:07] But if I'm with a therapist and I'm trying to work through something painful and I make a joke, I hate that they're holding back laughter. Like I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no. I need that though. Like I need that to open up the other door. Right. Like if you're just shutting it down, then I'm going to shut it down because I'm like, okay, we're not we're not on the same page. No. Oh, my gosh.

[00:10:28] If you don't laugh at dark humor as a therapist, then like you maybe like just didn't experience your own shit, you know, like some like you, you find each type of therapist and they're all great. Right. Like no big deal. But like there are certain people who need that vibe. And there are other people who really don't want to know shit about their therapist and don't really want their therapist to like show up as a human. Like it really depends. And like genuinely, like that's why I always tell therapists that I talk to.

[00:10:52] It's like your clients are you need to make sure you find the clients you want to work with because like I don't want to work with clients like that. I'm allowed to say that I'm a private business owner. Like if I don't want to work with you because I think you're looking for a therapist that I'm not, you deserve the therapist that works for your vibe. And that's why in my consultations, I'm like, this is how I like I push my clients. I'm not the one that's like, oh, I'm okay with taking your money and you just come here and do nothing. I'm like, no, fuck that. Like I got some people on my waitlist who like really want to work with me.

[00:11:20] So like you want to do the work or you don't like let's go like how are we feeling like you didn't want to be like this. Let's change some shit. Like you need people who are willing to like go in all different facets of life with you and laughing at dark shit is like one of the most important ways to heal. Like genuinely I make jokes like my dad sucks. And so like I make jokes about it all the time. Like my partner will like, like talk about like, oh, well, you know, I didn't I wasn't super close to my dad. I was like, yeah, me either. I don't even know his name.

[00:11:50] Like don't know his middle name. Like don't know his birthday. Who could be the dad? You know, I don't see laughing about it. Like it like comes out of left field. He's like, whoa, you good? I'm like, yeah, it's great. I love that because I'm super honest with my therapist and she gets me right. So we do laugh, you know, but she's helped me through some of the hardest times in my life.

[00:12:12] And, you know, it's funny because, you know, here I quit my day job yesterday, my last day ever in corporate America. And I'm opening my own business. And like she was super raw shishkoomba, like cheering me on. And, you know, thank God for Dirty Skittles. I mean, she kind of pushed me, too. And I'm so excited for what the future holds. But I had this major epiphany the other day, you know, two years ago, sitting in my room.

[00:12:41] I was ready to commit suicide. And today I'm opening my own business. And it took a lot of fucking work to get there. But I'm so proud of myself. And I'm being super vulnerable and I'm going to put myself out there. And I know it's not going to be easy, but I'm never, ever working for another person again. Ever. I feel like that's half my job trying to talk my clients out of being employees.

[00:13:10] I'm like, you know, you can be your own boss. Like you're really fucking smart, bro. I hate corporations. I really do. I'm like, I like talk about I hate insurance companies. I'm like, like, I just say being an employee is like low key, one of the hardest things in society that I just don't think I'll ever be able to partake in and ever again. Yeah, no, it's true. And it's unfortunate.

[00:13:36] I think that it took me this long to see certain aspects because like, I don't think that that just happened. Right. Like, I think when you work for a company that has really great values and you are like completely in the Kool-Aid and you're just everything is great. And then as soon as that changes and you're actually struggling to get through some shit and the company that you work for is all about them and protecting themselves.

[00:14:04] All of a sudden, it's like you're starting to see like insurance companies are not really there for you. You know what I mean? Like they're like, yeah, sure. We'll wear the hat and the shirt and say we're there for you, but we're also going to protect the company. So like, what do we got to do to get you back to being that employee? You know, like that's really, really tough. I work with it. I work on, I'm not like a career counselor. Okay. You know, I'm a people counselor. I guess that's how I would say it.

[00:14:32] Like whatever this person's problem is, like, let's fucking figure it out and let's see how we can make it feel better. Like doesn't. So I'm very eclectic. I don't feel like I am like pigeonholed in any type of like theology or anything like that. But career stuff happens a lot for my clients because they're very high achieving, like really smart. I'm like a rocket scientist, project managers, like engineers, like really smart people.

[00:14:56] And the amount of times that I find that my clients are so loyal to their company over themselves. That's what I care about. And like, I'm okay. Like there's this weird thing that happens. Like when you want to further your career and your company is not supporting you, you want a new title change. And they keep giving you the run around and you're like, oh, I finally found this job. I'm going to, I just got it. And I need to go to it. Now I have to put my two weeks. No, I feel so bad. Like, I feel like I'm putting them in a bad spot. I'm like, they would replace, they will replace you.

[00:15:26] They do not care. You were invaluable to them. And this is how they treated you anyway. Like go find another place. Like, do not feel bad furthering your career. Like if they were looking out for you, they would have listened to all the advocation that you put in. Right? Like there's also been like racial things that have happened in businesses where I've seen both reactions. Business completely fucking be terrible and not support my client at all. And the business being able to be like, oh, I hear you. Like, let's start this committee. Like, let's talk about these problems. Like, let me support my employees.

[00:15:56] So it's like, I think you make a really good point. It depends on where you're at. But the most important skill I see for people that are employees that they need to have is loyalty to themselves and the ability to advocate. And within that, I always talk to my clients about the flow of communication. You have to understand what is the flow of communication and within your business or within the company that you work for so that you can properly advocate. Like, when you're a person of color, you can't trust every HR person.

[00:16:24] You can't trust every single person that is working at this company. Like, who do you trust that is above you? How can you talk about this complicated situation in a way that feels safe? And how can you trust that person to communicate to the right person and you make sure that you tell them who they should be communicating to? Right? Like, just breaking things down like that helps people feel like they have tangible things that they can go do. And of course, like, it's then now their choice to go do those things or not.

[00:16:52] And I mean, to see clients like step into that power and have those conversations is like so rewarding for them. And like seeing how that shifts their mindset of being loyal to themselves and like sticking up for themselves and how it makes their work environment feel better. Like, that's really the most important thing, those skills. If you're going to be an employee, you better have sharpened the fuck out of your advocating skills. Like, make sure they're sharp. And don't feel like it's too much, right? Like advocating for yourself is what you need to do.

[00:17:22] Don't, don't have any shame around it. How did you get to this point? You had said something before that when you have somebody who believes in you and all that, that helps. So who believed in Alicia before to get you here? Oh, my God. So many fucking people. I was so lucky. Like, I really think.

[00:17:52] So when I was younger, I was like super into sports and I played basketball. I played basketball in college, like high school. I was decent at basketball. Okay. So people wanted me on their team. And a lot of my coaches, when I'm looking back at it, especially now that I'm an adult with my own income, I like think about how many people in my life just gave to me. And like, did not like monetarily made sure I could get to that tournament.

[00:18:20] I had coaches that would, they lived in Indianapolis. I lived in Columbus, Indiana, which was like 45 minutes south of Indianapolis. And they would drive and we were going to Indianapolis. They would leave their house, pick me up from school on like Friday and drive me to their house. So I could go to the tournament with them. And my head coach, Todd Amon, love you to death. You're an amazing person. And Brad Moan. I mean, these people like changed my life. I was just talking to Brad Moan's wife, Paula, just the other day.

[00:18:49] Like she messaged me like, you're so beautiful. I'm so proud of you. All these things. I'm like, Oh my God, you're like my second mom. Like, I love you so much. Thank you for being there for me. Like, and it wasn't just the fact that they, like, as a kid, I didn't think like, oh, they're buying me food or, oh, they're spending gas money on me. Like, oh, I thought about the love that they gave me. Like the genuine acceptance and like the genuine happiness it felt like they felt when I was around. And like the acceptance of like, hey, like we're not going to treat you different because we know you're different. Like we're, you're our little buddy. You're in our group.

[00:19:20] Like, we love you. You're amazing. Like we believe in you. And just like the intense amount of positive affirmation I got from people in sports was amazing. Now, of course I had my struggles. Like, and that's what makes me understand and relate to my clients. It's just why I needed all these people's support. Right. But like my mom is also like super, super creative.

[00:19:41] We were really fucking poor, like homeless, like lights shut out, water, eating ramen noodles and PB&Js, like a candlelight, you know, like shit like that on the regular.

[00:19:54] And so I would say like for a long time, I really was so angry with my mom that I couldn't see some of the amazing benefits that she was still able to provide to me, even when we were going through all these things that like now, the more I go on my healing journey, the more I realize like she has skill deficits. And also there's some neurodivergence in my family.

[00:20:20] And it's very possible that, you know, there's some neurodivergence in her brain that really inhibited her ability to do certain things. But she was a single mom. I have an amazing partner. Like, and I have seen myself just grow into the person I was supposed to be because of the love that he has provided me. And she never got that. Still to this day, she's not, she doesn't date. She's not remarried. Like she was solo dolo for years and years.

[00:20:49] Only she sacrificed everything for her kids. And I think a lot of people can, could judge like, you know, how we grew up and blame her for everything. But all I see now is a woman who never gave up, who always had a job, who always had multiple jobs, who did everything she could to make sure that her two daughters didn't hate their bodies and loved their hair and, you know, had support and felt confident.

[00:21:14] And I remember I would come home and be like, this person made fun of my jeans because they're, I wore them yesterday or whatever. And she would be like, you know what, tell that person, why are you noticing my jeans? Why do you even, why do you know what I'm wearing? Why are you worried about it? And I would, I was super sassy if you could imagine that. And I would go to school the next day and be like, why are you watching my jeans? That's weird. Like, stop doing that. And they would be like, okay. And so she really helped me develop a voice, you know, like there was a time in middle school.

[00:21:44] It sounds crazy, but like this poor guy, he had his own struggles. He, this kid in my class, he kind of smacked me in the face. It sounds crazy when I say it, but like I was in science class and he was like trying to play a joke, but I grew up in a domestic violence house. And so I don't joke like that. And so this kid like wound up and kind of smacked me. It wasn't like super hard, but it was hard enough to piss me off. I was in seventh grade. I turned around.

[00:22:09] I smacked him so hard in the face that he had like this red handprint on his face and I don't get in trouble. Okay, guys, like rule follower to the day that I die, not a big risk taker. So I was freaking out because my science teacher only saw me hit him. He didn't see him hit me. Of course, we tell the kids this right. You're always going to get caught if you're retaliating. So they sent me to the Dean and I was pretty close to the Dean. He's a track coach. He was my coach. He was like, what the fuck are you doing here?

[00:22:39] I'm in trouble. And they're like, you hit someone. I was like, he hit me first. And they're like, that doesn't matter. I was like, it doesn't. And my mom came and she, cause she always told me like, if someone's doing something pretty much like some fuck shit to you, like defend yourself. If someone hits you, you can defend yourself. And so she came in. She's so good at advocating for her kids. And she went into the Dean's office and was like, okay, so tell me the situation.

[00:23:07] Alicia told me that this young man hit her in the face. Why is she the only one down here? And he was like, well, the science teacher did not see this kid hit her and she doesn't have any marks on her. And we don't have a zero tolerance. And they were trying to sustain me or something. Right. And she was like, okay, well, we'll take the consequence. We understand. However, as long as you're comfortable with us going to school board about how there's no reparation or anything like that for this person who hit her and she will be back on Monday and she will take her whatever.

[00:23:34] That's fine. But you will have to deal with the consequences of him not getting in trouble for this. And they were like, okay, well, we know her. She's fine. Like we'll send her back to class. We just really wanted to clear this up. And I remember coming out of the office. I was like, am I in trouble? She's like, no, you're fine. Just go back to school and we'll talk about it when you get home. And I was like, oh, my mom's a GP. Like, you know, I think.

[00:24:03] Witnessing her, you know, and sometimes be extremely vulnerable and not be able to protect herself. Was really hard for me. It was really hard for me. And I think it made me judge her. I thought she was so passive. I was like, why don't you just protect yourself? Why aren't we out of this situation? Like all the things. Right. And I think now I know so much about being a survivor and like what it takes to get out of situations like that.

[00:24:31] And I know how extremely complex it is in the brain. Right. It's not so simple. And I mean, she is a survivor 1000%. And I think watching her go through what she went through and then watching how she just never gave up. Like, or just really ignited a fire in me to just be the same way. Like I'm going to fight for whatever I'm on the playground. Just in the, I made friends by making sure that bullies weren't picking on them several times in my life.

[00:24:59] I was willing to be the person standing on my own against all these kids who were like, just join the group thing. Join the group thing. I'm not that person. I'm not that type of person. I will stand in front of 50 people if they're like, and that those experiments where they're like, is this line longer than this line? And everyone like, is like a played actor. And they're like, yeah, this line. So I would never be the person that's like, yeah, that's the line. I would be like, you guys are all fucking crazy. I don't care how many fucking people you put in this. I'm looking right at the line.

[00:25:28] You're all crazy, right? Like, and sometimes that could be bad, but most of the time it serves me well. So yeah, it's tons and tons of people like friends and family, friends, like so many people who just, I lived in a small community and they just loved who I was. They loved my authenticity. They loved how I stood up for the underdog. And so they wanted to protect me. They wanted to be there for me. And it's really cool being an adult, knowing that what made me cool was me just being myself. And that's why I teach all of my clients.

[00:25:57] It's like, I'm telling you, I'm telling you what makes you incredible is you being yourself. When you're trying to be someone else is actually when everyone dislikes you because everyone can tell, like, it's annoying. It's over. It's too much. Like, just be who you are. And then people who like that will gravitate towards you and people who don't will repel. So you'll be better for it, you know? Right. Yeah. And feeling safe to be able to do that. Yeah. That's huge. What a wonderful story, though. Like your mom's not like, I mean, I think that that's beautiful.

[00:26:27] Despite the struggles and stuff, you were able to see her strength and take that on, too, and know that it's okay to be strong as a woman and advocate for yourself. Okay. And look where it brought you today. Right? Like, you're your own woman and you're making a difference in the world and you're helping those other people that, you know, may have been like a many, you know, many years ago and just giving them some strength because sometimes we all just need a little push. Yeah.

[00:26:56] And, you know, you took me to the edge and then you all pushed me off and you're like, okay, go fly. Right. So we're going to see what happens. But like, I'm so proud of you for like doing that and finding that joy. And what are your like aspirations for like, like 2025 and forward? Oh, my gosh.

[00:27:17] It's so funny because I do also think it's so like, I think a lot about how I grew up and how I'm like, it's actually become some like one of the greatest gifts to me to like grow up with nothing. Because I only dreamt so big because I really didn't even know how, what world could be like, like, you know, and so like, I, I like all I could think about when I was younger was getting to college and graduating college. And like, once I did that, I remember being like, oh my God, I stopped there.

[00:27:46] Like, I didn't even think like past graduating college. Like, I just, and that's really common with people who grew up before. Like, you don't think past tomorrow. You're just like paycheck to paycheck, like really trying to figure it out. And I didn't realize that until I was in grad school and I was like, oh, that makes total sense. And I think for me right now, it's like, it feels like the possibilities are endless.

[00:28:06] Like ever since I started Instagram and realized that like, there's so many other ways to monetize the knowledge that I have and like, and that people need it and want it in so many different ways. Like I am like just trying to take my Alicia-ness and my knowledge and find ways to express it that connect to my soul and my story.

[00:28:30] So, I mean, this year I haven't even told anybody about this really, but I am like coming out with like series of coloring books and journals. They're kind of worked together. I'm obsessed with coloring. I love art. I was like a random art student and in high school, I took art every single semester of every year when I was in high school. I was like best friends with my art teacher, Mr. Ponsford. I mean, he's rest in peace. Love him to death. He's incredible too.

[00:28:57] But yeah, so I really had a fun time. I created these four different coloring books that are, that also have journal prompts within them. So I'm potentially going to be selling those. I really made them for myself because I wanted to like, I like coloring, but I don't like those intense adult coloring books, you know? Like, like, oh my God, like this is just like so much work. I just wanted something like fun and simple. Like, I created like different levels.

[00:29:25] And like, I literally just like picked the cutest little creatures and like animals and just like all the things that like, I feel like heal my inner child. I'm like, I can't wait to color this. And so, and then I also like always like neurodivergent here. Like when I'm listening to something, I'm doodling. Like in high school, all of my like notebooks had like borders on them of just like different designs and shit.

[00:29:49] And so I kind of created a geometrical shape one where I can, you can color all these different lines and shapes and stuff. And so like that's coming out. I'm also creating an anxiety workbook that like follows my anxiety protocol for clients because I get a lot of people that want to work with me for anxiety. And one of the things that my background really helps me with anxiety is that I worked with kids for several years when I started out in my career.

[00:30:12] And that really taught me how to break down really complex skills in a way that's very tangible for people to just like take things and work on them in the real world. Cause that's like the hard thing from therapy is like, how do you take what I'm learning in therapy and use it in the real world? And that's like a big specialty of mine because of that experience. And so I decided that I turn away a lot of clients cause I have a lot of boundaries. All right. I don't want to work with more than 20 people in a week, you know, I have to turn away a lot of clients.

[00:30:41] And so I'm trying to find ways to utilize people who want to work with me and my alitianess and give them something that they can utilize without actually doing one-on-one work with me. I'm also really excited about our retreat in Portugal. Like we have that coming up in the spring. So like, I'm honestly just like expanding my business. I don't even have a legit website guys. Like you just find me on psychology today. Like, and I'm like full, like, I don't know. I'm not a legit business owner.

[00:31:09] I feel like, like I pay my taxes. Like I like to have a registration, but like all these people are like so legit. And I'm going to get a website this year. That's on my fucking to-do list. Okay. So I'm going to legitimize myself. But yeah, like those are like, I'm really excited to just like keep using my brain and like finding new ways to help bring access to care. Cause that's the biggest thing for me is like when I was a kid, I really needed mental health.

[00:31:35] And I think my mom was really fearful of letting us go to therapy because she was so afraid of us being taken from her. She was really afraid that like what we were going through was reportable, which it definitely was. And so, you know, in some ways, good call. Like I didn't want to go to foster care, but you know, actually back then they wouldn't have taken you away for witnessing domestic violence. That's like kind of a newer thing. But anyway, so I didn't get any therapy back then.

[00:32:01] And I really feel like the, if there was more access to understanding why mental health was important and for all different levels of compensation, like that's my goal. That's I want mental health care to be accessible to all people. I want it to have varying price schedules. I want it to be like, you can get an excellent therapist and you can afford it no matter where you're at. And if you can't work with that therapist, this therapist has all these other things that you can try to do to help yourself before you can work with them. Like that's my goal.

[00:32:30] I just want people to be able to access mental health care. And I want to de-stigmatize like what it looks like. Like it can be anything. I talk to this so often with my female clients and my women clients who have men in their lives that don't want to go to therapy. And I'm like, give them a break. Like think about what they've been taught their whole lives. Therapy is going to be like the last step. Okay. You got to do all of these other steps first. Like ask them if they will do a self-care workbook. Are they going to go to watch a YouTube video? What about this documentary? What about these apps?

[00:32:58] Like, you know, try these other things first and see if that helps them get excited about therapy and then jump into therapy. So that's my goal. If I could say anything, it's just like trying to expand my business to, and create more access and all different levels for people to engage with their mental health and learn more about their brain and how it works. How did you get, or how did you find that space from, you mentioned you were in sports to now mental health?

[00:33:27] Like, I guess that's a big leap. Honestly, it's so funny. Like I was going to be a lawyer. That's what I think about now. My kind of people. I really wanted to be an advocate lawyer. Like I was like, and you know what? I went to a mock law class. I went to a private school for college and it was an excellent education, like really great community of like a really small school.

[00:33:53] And so they had all these resources and coming from a kid that grew up on all the government support. I was like, I'm using every fucking one of these resources, mock law class. I'm fucking going. So I went to a mock law class and I'm telling you right now, one of the first things he said was like, if you want to do law in this way, you're not going to make any money. And I was like, fuck. And he's like, and you're going to have student loan debt that is pretty much never going to be paid off because you're not going to make any money. And also, if you're not going to test taking.

[00:34:22] Yeah, you're not going to get any scholarships because I had a full ride to my undergrad and my private school institution was not paid by me. Okay, it was paid by a Pell Grant 21st century scholarship in the Benjamin Templeton scholarship program. So like I didn't pay a penny for my undergrad, which is like amazing. I was like my mom again, like fucking beast. She was like this application, fill out this application, do these things in high school so you can get scholarships. Like she was on it from day one.

[00:34:51] But yeah, so I was in school. I did that mock law class and instantly was like, I don't want to be a lawyer. Didn't want to tell my mom. So I was like, fuck, what are we going to do? I majored in sociology, decided to major in sociology, which is hilarious. I went in as poli sci. I went to my advisor, my freshman advisor, still to this day, some of the best advice I've ever been given. And I was like, I think I want to major in sociology, but I don't know what the fuck to do with that. I feel like that's a waste of my time. And she was like, let me just be very clear.

[00:35:21] If you follow your passion, your career will come. If you're passionate about sociology, you will find what you want to do with it. And I was like, okay, you're fucking probably right. You're probably right. All right, I'm going to do it. And then I was sitting with my seventh grade mentee because there's a lot of requirements for my scholarship program. One of them was that you had to be involved, obviously. And so I had a seventh grade mentee. And one of the things we were doing was like figuring out what career path she should go down.

[00:35:49] And they had her take this big, long career thing. And I was like helping her to do it all. And we sit down. And one of the careers that pops up is a guidance counselor, a counselor, mental health counselor. And we're like, oh, let's read through it. What is it? Like literally, I don't even know what this is. Like, let's figure it out. And it was like up and coming fields. In 20 years, this field will be booming. And for kids, she was like, we were reading through it. And I was like, this kind of sounds cool. Like, maybe you would like this.

[00:36:19] She was like, you know what? Actually, this sounds like a job you should do. And I was like, damn, she's so right. I was like, so I picked my whole entire career. And I instantly from that moment on was like, okay, I'm going to listen to seventh graders now. So yeah, and I figured it out. I added communication. I double majored in sociology communication. And my senior year, I took the GRE and fucking applied to one grad school because that was the only one I wanted to go to.

[00:36:49] And I got in. And that was it. And I was like, after I got into grad school, I mean, it was so obvious. I like fell in love with therapy. I was like, oh my God, this is what I should be doing this my whole life. Actually, I have been doing this my whole life. I was everyone's little fucking therapist. Every single one of my basketball teams and especially in college, like you're living with your team. Like you, I mean, I was an RA in college too. So I'm a freshman RA at that.

[00:37:16] So of course, I'm like fucking supporting all these little baby newcomers to college and all my teammates every year. I was like team mom. I'm like, I mean, it literally was. I was, I feel like I was born to be a therapist. That's like genuinely how I feel. And I look back at my life and it's so funny now I'd be talking to people and I'll just be being myself. And they're like, oh, you're in therapist mode. I'm like, bro, no, like this is just who I am. Like, I promise you, I'm not trying to dig deep into your like demons. I'm just chatting with you. Like, I don't know.

[00:37:46] Like, this is just what happens. It's so funny. So yeah, a seventh grader picked out my career and luckily she was right. So it's good. I love her name. Kayla. Kayla. Shout out to Kayla. Shout out to Kayla. Wherever you are. I hope you're doing so good. I believe you. I love this for you.

[00:38:12] And I just, I love your energy and, you know, your willingness to like dig deep with your clients and, you know, just make mental health more accessible for everyone. Really, that's, you know, what our mission is just to normalize those conversations. But, you know, you're out there digging deep and you've made me feel better. This is like the perfect way to start off our 2025 season. I know. Thank you. I love that. Thank you guys. That's so sweet.

[00:38:40] I'm excited to ask you my random questions. Are you ready for this? Oh, I'm ready. Rapid fire, baby. All right. I'm just kidding. All right. If you could go back in time to a younger version of yourself and give that younger version a bit of advice, what would you say? And how old are you when you go back to give advice? Oh, oh my gosh. It's so funny.

[00:39:08] I actually have answered this question on my Instagram before. So I thought about this and what I said on my Instagram was that I would have told myself to relax. If you can imagine me without my healedness, I was like genuinely so high strung. Like I was like, fuck. I mean, it was, but for me, I, when I look back, I'm, I, so I'm like 15 at the age of like, that I'm thinking of like 15, 16.

[00:39:37] And I was very intense. Like, and my, I'm actually, my boyfriend went to high school with me. He's known me my, like my whole life. And it's really funny. Like, well, when we get to like share thoughts or memories or like, like, why did you, how did you perceive me? And it's really funny how different people perceived me than I felt like people did. But I think a lot of people respected how serious I was, but I don't think they understood like the turmoil that it caused within me.

[00:40:02] Like, and like, I don't think people understood that I was so serious because genuinely my education was my life or death. Like it was my only ticket out of poverty. It was my only ticket into like a life that was not just survival mode. And so for me, I had this like intense, intrinsic motivation to just like get the fuck out of Dodge. Like I got to get to college.

[00:40:26] And I guess like backwards thinking here is my sister, you know, I love my sister so much. I'm the only one of my siblings that got a college degree. And my sister is extremely capable, amazing basketball player, got a full right D1 scholarship. In her senior year, like her life blew up. And now she's a part of the LGBT community. And she came out like, like the summer before this all happened. And like, now that I'm older, I totally think those things connect, right?

[00:40:55] Like I do genuinely think she was having such a really hard time. And I don't think she had as much support for that specific thing than I did with all the things that I was going through.

[00:41:16] Witnessing her life go from almost out of here to a D1 scholarship to literally like struggle with drugs and like arrests, like fucked me up. Like she was like the only person I looked up to. Like I didn't look up to my mom the same way I do now because I really was angry with her. And so like, I really looked up to my sister. Everyone loved my sister. She was incredible. She is incredible person. And she just, her whole life imploded.

[00:41:45] And so that was really, that put a lot of pressure on me. Like I really was so scared because it really put into perspective that you, everything can change so fast. Like you can be doing all the right things and you make one mistake and your life is fucking over. And so for me, I was like, I'm not going to parties. I'm not drinking. I'm not smoking weed. I'm not doing fucking shit. And no, I'm not going to show up because if the cops come, I get equally in trouble. I don't care if I have one step. I'm like, I was so serious. And I would like yell at my friends.

[00:42:15] I was like, stop doing this. I don't want to be a part of it. I don't want to hang out with you. I was like super serious. And like, I got straight A's. Like I wouldn't let people cheat off of me. Like I just was so afraid of getting in trouble that I was super fucking intense. And so I think looking back, I would, I logically thought I would say like relax, but I think like now looking back, cause I, I, that really saved my life.

[00:42:43] The mentality that I had, I think I would say like, thank you for being so fucking focused. And fucking driven and just powerful. Like you are in, I think about her a lot. Like I want to tap into that Alicia because damn, she got a lot done at a fucking tiny age. Like I can't believe some of the things that I look back at her and like, wow. Like in the midst of all the fucking shit you were going through. My mom's favorite story is before one of the sectional championships I played and I played really well.

[00:43:11] Our electricity was cut off like the night before. And it was like, I mean, I, it's a winter sport, cold as fucking balls. They're not even really supposed to do that. Like we got the fucking shit into the stick and my mom was so nervous. I wasn't gonna be able to play. And I showed up and I fucking crushed it and we won the game. And she was like, I don't think anyone would ever fucking guess like what you're going through. And she's right. People didn't know. I thought it was like a big red scarlet all over me, but like no one understood.

[00:43:37] And so I think if I look back at her now, I would just be like, I love you so much. And I'm so fucking proud of like your intensity. And I'm sorry that I shamed you for that. Like it was a big issue. Like it was survival that you fucking survived. And wow, like you're really fucking good at that. Like super proud of you. And I think like, I understand why she was that way. And instead of like shaming that part of me, I think I just would love to embrace her and be like, I would not be here without you, babe.

[00:44:08] Like you fucking are my ride or die. My little 15 year old self, like she's fucking more incredible than me. I love that. I think you're the only guest that would think they're younger version. Yeah. I love that though, because it's actually super enlightening. Because I think we do forget just how crazy it was and what we were going through. And the fact that we, whatever decisions we made have made who we are today.

[00:44:37] I mean, it's wonderful. I love that. All right. Do you have another like crazy ass question? Yeah. What has been the hardest lesson that you've had to learn at least to date? Uh-oh. Uh-oh. Oh, we contemplated hard lessons. Oh, man. Now you're stumped her. Nice. Yeah, I am stumped.

[00:45:00] I feel like I've had a lot of hard lessons, but like the hardest lesson and yeah, I don't want to go too deep into it just out of respect for the other person that was involved. But I've been divorced before. It's not something like a lot of people know about me. And I think that was like one of the hardest lessons I've ever gone through because all of

[00:45:25] my other lessons, I felt like I could blame other people and I could be like, this person did this to me. This person did this to me. This person did that to me. And in that situation, it was like, honey, like you did this to yourself. Like you, I lost myself so far down this rabbit hole of like really wanting a partner and really wanting, wanting like a connection with somebody. So I didn't have to live alone like my whole life, like my mom did.

[00:45:55] And so I think I really changed and I put myself into that box. And that's why I talk about that with my clients so much is because I talk a lot about interpersonal relationships, friendships, relationships with parents, partners, like all of these things. And when I hear people talking about shrinking, it's like, yeah, that, that word right there. I'm like, yeah, you're in a box, bro. Like, and that person might be like, okay with you in that box. And I felt like looking back at it now, my partner at that time was okay with me being

[00:46:24] in the box and like, kind of felt like I belonged in that box and like saw all the things that I went through as like a hindrance rather than a strength. And like the way that I left that relationship was awful. Like I, I lost myself so badly that I, that's the only time I've ever in my life done something so out of character. And I actually cheated on my partner and left. I mean, it wasn't like an affair.

[00:46:51] Like I cheated once and like next day, I was like, I've got to break up with you. I can't be with you anymore. Like, I'm really sorry. This isn't going to work. I don't want to be this person. And it really wasn't about him. It was about me. Like I couldn't be myself with him. I couldn't, and I don't know if that's necessarily his fault. I wouldn't blame him for that. And I don't know, I don't know where he's at. We have literally not spoken since this, but like, it was my fault because I changed myself to be what I thought he wanted me to be.

[00:47:21] And that lesson, man, it woke me right up. I was like, cause I really hate doing things that I said I would never do. And I've learned to also just give myself some grace and be like, you never know, babe, you might make some fucking big mistakes. And I've, I mean, I've always been like, once I chater, always I chater. And I mean, I, everyone's really sensitive with that topic. And you know, like people might fucking light me on fire for this. I'm on a podcast. I guess I shouldn't even be talking about it.

[00:47:49] But at the end of the day, it was the biggest life lesson I've ever done because I, people really judged me for this. And like people knew what happened. And I learned very quickly, like who were people that really believed in me and saw it as a one-off, right? Because I'd have all these other years of being like this other person whose character is like very strong. And some people were allowed to use that as one example to be like, no, that's not who you are anymore.

[00:48:16] But for me, it helped me even realize like, just because someone's done something really horrible and really awful to someone does not mean that that's who they are. And that does not mean you understand why they made that choice. And I think for me, I made that choice because I keep my partner was really fucking smart and really good at like twisting things to like get what he wanted. And I think he really wanted me to stay in that relationship. And I felt like I had to fucking blow it up.

[00:48:44] That's, that was like the unlogical side of my brain. I was like, fucking set it on fire and you will never be able to stay with this again. Like, there's no way you could like, cause I knew myself, I wouldn't, be able to stay with him after I did that. Like, I just knew within my own heart, like I couldn't, and I don't feel like I could have faced him without just blowing it all up. And that's not true. Right. I had the choice. Like I could have done it way better.

[00:49:09] And if I would go back in time, I would have, but I fell in love. And I, the person I'm with now is like, sorry, it's like really emotional because I didn't even know that I could be loved so deeply by another person. Right. Like, and I, I've never been with somebody who was just so, he just sees me, you know,

[00:49:36] he just knows my heart and like really believes in me. And like, I just wasn't getting that in any other area of life. And even at my absolute lowest, he was like, nah, babe, like I know who you are. Like you're, this is not who you are. Like you, you really lost yourself and you have got to find it again. Like, I know who you are and like, let me help you. And the love that he was able to provide to me has like healed me so much.

[00:50:04] Like just incredible human. He is just an amazing person. And the way I, I, I talk about this all the time, like in the sense of like, if I had to create the love of my life from scratch, like I wouldn't change a single thing about him. Like I would just recreate him. I'd be like, that's him. Let's just bring him back. Like, you know, like I honestly, like, so for me, I made a terrible choice and how I did it, but it changed my life for the better.

[00:50:32] Like I would have never opened my own business because my other partners didn't believe in me, didn't encourage me in that way. Like really made a lot more money than me and like made my job. Oh, I didn't believe in therapy in the same way that my new partner does. Like, just like there were so many differences that were not supporting like my growth and keeping me in this tiny fucking box. And I'm huge. I have a massive personality. I can't live in the box without fucking having to fight my way out.

[00:51:02] And I did, I blew the box up and everyone can judge me for it. I understand. I have forgiven myself because I understand why I did it, but I also understand why people have paused with it and like have a problem with it. And I would too. So I think at the end of the day, that was like a really the first time I've ever just like disappointed myself in like such a serious way. And I learned so much about the signs of how I lost myself that now I feel like I'll never find myself in that situation ever again.

[00:51:31] So thank God for that situation. But really fucking hard time in my life as an adult, like only person to blame was me. So that fucking sucks. I just, I love how open you've been and I love following you on Instagram. Your posts always give me the warm and fuzzies and always remind me, you know, of things that I need to do to take care of my own mental health. But I have two questions and then I want to find out how people can find you on Instagram

[00:52:00] and all over the world. So as a therapist, what do you do for self-love and self-care? Oh my gosh. All of the things. I, so I just started in 2025. I started the Mel Robbins morning routine. Oh my God. It has been amazing for me so far. I love it. I don't start work until like 10 or 11 most days, but I'm an early riser. So I wake up around six or like sometimes seven, but before the daylight savings and it was

[00:52:28] like pitch black, I was waking up at like five 30. So I'm sure that will change again with daylight savings again. But so that's been really helpful. I, so you essentially wake up and you don't get on your phone. Like I literally don't touch my phone for like probably the first like two or three hours of the day. And I, cause sometimes you'll get like client messages or like, and I just, actually, I just realized I didn't respond to a message. Actually, I need to respond. I didn't check it until later.

[00:52:58] And I was like, oh fuck, I need to get back to that. Anyway. So that I do that. I go on a 10 minute walk. You got to get sunlight, fresh air, drink a cup of water and then five minutes of gratitude. And that has been like low key. I've been like super energized, like really having a really great start to my day. And sometimes I'll get content. Sometimes I'll do some marketing stuff, like whatever I can do afterwards. It just like helps me like plan my day and like take intentional time. I'm also like really, I am like, I have really strong boundaries.

[00:53:26] I pretty much don't talk to anybody on Monday through Thursday while I'm working. Like I just like don't have capacity to like take on a bunch of stuff. But so I reach out to my family and friends like on the weekends and do FaceTimes and stuff like that. I travel home pretty regularly to see my family at least like a couple of times a year and then have them come out. I spend a lot of really intentional time with my partner. Like we go on walks almost every day. We spend time like catching up. Like we, he's got so much shit to do now.

[00:53:56] Like we don't get as much time together. We're kind of used to spending like all of our time together. And so it's so weird how different it is now. But so we had to like no phone time. Like, okay, put your phones down. Like let's chat. Let's like catch up. Let's watch a show together. And then kind of going to bed and waking up together, trying to do that. Um, but I do, I mean, I do, I've gone to my own therapist before. I'm not in currently in therapy, but I do so much. I mean, I journal, I listen, I do meditations.

[00:54:24] Like pretty much everything I ask my clients to do for themselves. I do for myself and we'll me and my partner will do like bi monthly or like every other month, like check-ins or like, Hey, how's our mental health? Like, how am I showing up for you as a partner? Like, you know, those types of things. So like, it's kind of endless. I think of it as like a lifestyle. Like my mental health is a massive part of my lifestyle. And if I'm not being productive towards taking care of my mental health, then like, I don't feel as good. Oh, exercise.

[00:54:53] I work out or move them. I don't like to call it working out. I move my body like almost every single day. I try not to have like restrictions or anything about like what that is. Cause I was an athlete. And so for a long time, I had to like really revamp what my idea of like moving my body looks like. And changing that was really important. Changing it from exercise to me in my body was really helpful. So language, I'm really particular in the language I use. Yeah. I mean, I'm kind of rambling at this point. Cause it's like everything in my life is about taking care of my mental health.

[00:55:23] I have extreme trauma history. So it's a literal daily thing. And I try to tell my clients that it's not like, Oh, I'm healed. No, I have to like keep healing. I had to like keep doing the things that helped me feel healed. That's kind of like how I operate. Yeah. I like that you called it a lifestyle. It is a mental health lifestyle. Just, you know, working on yourself every day. So how can our listeners find you? You're a ball of energy.

[00:55:50] So I love that you're a ball of energy because some days I am not a ball of energy. I do have a ton of energy. One of my favorite compliments I've ever received was from my boyfriend's dad. And he was like, you're just really excitable. And I was like, Oh, I mean, I've never been described that way. And then after that, like Eli and I just like talked about it. We're like, yeah, we're both kind of excitable. Like we just are really happy. And like, so any little thing can get me excited.

[00:56:19] But yeah, you guys can find me on therapy in real life and Instagram. I also am on psychology today. So that's where my, like a lot of my clients come from on there. I'm also on Alma. Like if you haven't heard of Alma, it's a platform where you can set up a profile and use your insurance to connect with other therapists who take that insurance. That's the only way that I do insurance clients. And I have a cap on like how many clients I take. Honestly, right now, that's it.

[00:56:46] Like, I mean, I, like I said, guys, I'm not joking. I don't have a website yet, but if you wanted to come to my retreat, like hang out with me in Portugal, because that's going to be sick, you can go to unearthingchoicecounseling.com. And that is where you can find all the stuff about our retreat. Because the transformations from the Costa Rica retreat were incredible. Our clients like went from like feeling like indecisive and worried to like so calm. They didn't want to leave.

[00:57:15] They were like, this is the most peaceful community that I've been a part of in so long. And being able to just reset, they felt so energized to go back into their world and be like, I'm going to take this shit with me. I'm really going to like, they all had like routine goals that they were trying to implement and like, oh, it was so cool. Like they did incredible. So Portugal is going to be next level because our accommodations are way better too. So that's really it. I'm going to be coming out with a website. It's going to be pathtoempowermentcounseling.com.

[00:57:45] But TBD, like you'll see, just follow me on Instagram and you'll know where everything is because that's really where I put all my shit. I love that. Thank you so much for being vulnerable and open and sharing your life story. And this was awesome. I loved it. Yeah, I love this. Thank you so, so, so much. Hi, all. Thank you so much for listening to this episode. I'm G-Rex. And I'm Dirty Skittles. Don't forget to subscribe, rate and review this podcast. We'd love to listen to your feedback.

[00:58:15] We can't do this without you guys. It's okay to be not okay. Just make sure you're talking to someone.